--- Log opened Thu Jan 07 00:00:07 2010
--- Day changed Thu Jan 07 2010
00:00 < happy> dho: os.path makes is easy to make cross platform programs by
making it easy to edit paths
00:00 < dho> For example?
00:01 < happy> dho: for example.  os.path.join('an/example', 'path')
00:01 < happy> that gives different results depending on the os
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00:01 < happy> on linux it would give an/example/path
00:01 < happy> on windows an/example\path
00:02 < dho> Don't think so; Windows support is just getting there
00:03 < dagle> Shouldn't be to hard to do something like that.
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00:03 < happy> dho: I know, but it also has other tools (in python).  One
function can extend directories
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00:03 < happy> one can make absolute paths
00:03 < happy> ect
00:04 < happy> these are easy to build, but it is much cleaner when the lang
knows what to do based on how it is compiled
00:05 < dho> needs implementing :)
00:05 < happy> lol
00:05 < happy> yep
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00:45 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5PFJw by [Russ Cox] in go/src/pkg/time/ --
time: fix Makefile so deps.bash is happy (fixes build)
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02:02 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5PPq5 by [Hector Chu] in 8 subdirs of
go/src/pkg/runtime/ -- Ported runtime to Windows.
02:02 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5PPqi by [Russ Cox] in go/src/pkg/ --
deps.bash: handle space between .go and \ in GOFILES=
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02:19 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5PRsb by [Russ Cox] in go/src/cmd/8c/ -- 8c:
only refer to extern register variables in MOVL instructions
02:19 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5PRsi by [Russ Cox] in go/src/ -- sync
make-arm.bash with make.bash
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02:35 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5PTla by [Rob Pike] in go/src/pkg/io/ -- add a
standard interface that wraps ReadByte, io.ReadByter
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03:03 < jackman> So...
03:04 < jackman> I am gonna put together a superserver with Go.
03:04 < jackman> I'll have to call it GoD.
03:04 < jackman> :)
03:05 < Boggy-B> *rimshot*
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03:12 < Ycros> jackman: there's already a superserver that exists called
God, except it's written in Ruby
03:13 < Ycros> jackman: http://god.rubyforge.org/
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03:28 < jackman> "We're Sorry but this Project hasn't yet uploaded their
personal webpage yet."
03:28 < jackman> (in response to god.sf.net)
03:29 < jackman> err...
03:29 < jackman> nm
03:29 < jackman> :(
03:29 < jackman> that page that was /really/ quoted is slick
03:29 < jackman> thanks!
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03:37 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5Q0xT by [Russ Cox] in go/src/pkg/runtime/ --
runtime: close TODO now that 8c bug is fixed
03:37 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5Q0y5 by [Evan Shaw] in go/src/libmach/ --
libmach: Add disassembly for newly implemented opcodes
03:37 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5Q0yC by [Evan Shaw] in go/src/cmd/8g/ -- 8g:
float->uint64 conversion optimization
03:37 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5Q0zk by [Rob Pike] in go/test/bench/ --
update timing logs for benchmarks.
03:37 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5Q0A8 by [Rob Pike] in go/src/pkg/time/ --
make Format about twice as fast by removing allocations, using a bytes.Buffer
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09:50 < ghost10> hello :)
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10:24 < jackman> hello :)
10:25 < happy> hi
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11:14 < rog> test
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11:20 < jhh> rog: pong
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12:31 < dagle> Why is it that vectors in general have a initsize at 8?
12:32 < rog> dagle: sounds like an arbitrary small amount to me, because
most vectors will hold <8 elements, so it saves on a reallocation
12:33 < dagle> rog: Go have initialSize = 8, think java does too.
12:33 < Kashia> see codereview 165078
12:35 < dagle> Kashia: It's more like why 8?
12:35 < Kashia> ah :)
12:35 < rog> why not?
12:36 < dagle> Why this magic number that everybody seems to use?
12:36 < Kashia> my guess is: small and a number which is a power of 2 ;)
12:36 < rog> maybe they did a test and surveyed all the uses of vector and
found that 99% were <= 8
12:36 < rog> or maybe they just guessed
12:40 < rog> it does seem a slight pity that the minimal space requirement
for an empty vector is 72 bytes
12:41 < Kashia> maybe something like Qt's CoW/implicit sharing could be used
12:42 < rog> not easily, in a multicore enviromment
12:42 < rog> s/mment/nment/
12:43 < Kashia> I guess one would need thread local storage...
12:44 < rog> that's the reason AFAIK why strings are immutable.  limbo has
mutable strings with COW, but it becomes a problem when you have parallelism
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12:45 * rog is trying to decide if thread local storage is sufficient
12:46 < Kashia> well, since goroutines might be hopping between threads..
unsure.
12:46 < rog> indeed
12:47 < rog> and the vector can hop between goroutines too
12:48 < Kashia> and the accounting overhead of touching every CoW structure
on hops..  you are right, not easy.
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12:55 < Kashia> Qt apparently uses atomic reference counting to handle that
problem...
12:57 < kevinwatt> > f, _ := os.Open("/tmp/XD",
os.O_WRONLY|os.O_CREATE|os.O_SYNC, 0644);n, _ = f.WriteString("にほんご\n");f.Close()
12:57 < rndbot> <Error: undefined: n, cannot assign to n>
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12:58 < kevinwatt> > f, _ := os.Open("/tmp/XD",
os.O_WRONLY|os.O_CREATE|os.O_SYNC, 0644);var n int; n, _ =
f.WriteString("にほんご\n");f.Close()
12:58 < Kashia> := not =
12:58 < rndbot> SIGSEGV: segmentation violation Faulting address: 0x0
PC=0x80496c1 os·*File·WriteString+0x32 /home/mgruen/code/go/safe/src/pk...
13:04 < kevinwatt> Just curious of the bot really has os module or not.  :P
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13:17 < rog> Kashia: if you use atomic ref counting then almost every
assignment of a ref counted data structure needs to be interlocked
13:18 < rog> > os.Open("/tmp/XD", os.O_WRONLY|os.O_CREATE|os.O_SYNC,
0644)
13:18 < rndbot> <Error: illegal character 0xf>
13:18 < rog> > os.Open("/tmp/XD", os.O_WRONLY|os.O_CREATE|os.O_SYNC,
0644)
13:18 < rndbot> <no output>
13:19 < rog> > f, _ := os.Open("/tmp/XD",
os.O_WRONLY|os.O_CREATE|os.O_SYNC, 0644);fmt.Printf("%p\n", f)
13:19 < rndbot> <nil>
13:20 < rog> > f, _ := os.Open("/", os.O_RDONLY, 0); fmt.Printf("%p\n",
f)
13:20 < rndbot> <nil>
13:20 < rog> > _, err := os.Open("/", os.O_RDONLY, 0); fmt.Printf("%s\n",
err)
13:20 < rndbot> os.Open not allowed
13:20 < Kashia> huh
13:21 < Kashia> so atomic refs would lead to a drop in execution speed?
13:21 < rog> Kashia: yes - particularly on a multi core instance
13:22 < Kashia> I guess one would need to profile a large codebase on how it
behaves.  implicit sharing raising speed and atomic refs decreasing it again
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13:47 < abiosoft> hello
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13:56 < happy> hi
13:57 < abiosoft> hi
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14:30 < scoeri> does anybody know if go has tail-call optimisations?
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14:35 < scoeri> i guess not
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14:36 < alamu> hello :)
14:37 < scoeri> hi
14:37 < happy> hi
14:37 <+iant> scoeri: 6g does not do tail call optimizations currently
except in some very limited cases; gccgo does do tail call optimizations
14:37 < alamu> @scoeri: it is nice to meet u s
14:40 < scoeri> iant: thx, I'll check gccgo then
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14:48 < dagle> Hmmm.  Would be cool if there was an interface for spawning
go routines on a OpenCL device.
14:50 < dho> opencl implements a kernel?
14:50 < rog> difficult if the binary's only compiled for one processor.
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14:51 < rog> does opencl share memory with the initiator?
14:52 < dho> i don't know
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14:53 * dho is somewhat confused
14:53 < rog> from the eg on wikipedia, it looks like probably not
14:53 < dho> so opencl is a compiler
14:53 < rog> but i don't know anything about opencl
14:53 < dho> and language
14:54 < dho> http://www.khronos.org/opencl/sdk/1.0/docs/man/xhtml/
14:54 < dho> it's confusing is what it is :\
14:57 < rog> the intro doesn't make it clear, does it?
14:58 < rog> this gives a better idea:
http://www.khronos.org/files/opencl-quick-reference-card.pdf
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14:59 < rog> pertinent to the original remark: clCreateProgramWithSource
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15:02 < dagle> Just thought it was cute if you could spawn a go routine just
as easy on a gpu as on a cpu.
15:02 < scoeri> iant: im reading the gccgo install guide and it says here
that garbage collection is not yet implemented
15:02 <+iant> scoeri: that is correct
15:03 < scoeri> if so, then there is not much use for tail-call optimisation
:)
15:03 <+iant> sure, this stuff is all still experimental
15:04 * dho goes to urgent care facility
15:04 < dho> yuck sick etc.
15:04 <+iant> sorry to hear that
15:04 < dho> thanks
15:04 < dho> bbiab
15:06 < rog> "bring beer in a bottle"?
15:06 < rog> :-)
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15:29 * zeroXten starts his first play with go
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15:58 < bortzmeyer> Mercurial server down?  hg pull -> 'pulling from
https://go.googlecode.com/hg/ \ abort: HTTP Error 400: Bad Request'
16:01 < scoeri> i dont have that problem
16:02 < scoeri> i just pulled and build the last release 5min ago
16:02 < jhh> working fine for me too
16:02 < bortzmeyer> OK, broken proxy.  Undefining http_proxy solved it
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16:03 < scoeri> i have another problem, i updated 6g and now he can't find
the package "runtime" anymore
16:04 < scoeri> Environment.go:6: fatal error: can't find import: runtime
16:05 < jhh> i successfully recompiled everything seconds ago
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16:09 < zeroXten> hmm, can i just say that go is awesome
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16:11 < scoeri> i dont think anyone will complain in this channel :)
16:13 < scoeri> what other language are you used of writing?
16:18 < moraes> go, go!
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16:19 < zeroXten> mostly perl and bash, some ruby/python and c
16:19 < moraes> are there go games already?
16:19 < zeroXten> what would be a good way to parse a URL.RawQuery for
individual variable values?
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16:20 < zeroXten> Fields i guess
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16:21 < dho> strings.Split?
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16:21 < dho> you might look at web.go
16:21 < dho> http://github.com/hoisie/web.go
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17:29 < zeroXten> regexp for substr?
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17:30 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5RHTz by [Robert Griesemer] in
go/src/pkg/unicode/ -- added some missing periods
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17:43 < rog> anyone know if there is a way of recompiling the go source tree
without it doing a make clean first?
17:44 < dho> comment out the ./clean.bash in make.bash
17:44 < zeroXten> hmmm regexp is being a pain...  is there a substr?
17:44 < dho> no
17:45 < zeroXten> hmm, will have to do some crazy len stuff =/
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17:46 < zeroXten> how do i convert a int to string?
17:46 < rog> dho: it'd be nice if it was possible to do without making a
local modification...
17:46 <+iant> zeroXten: strconv.Itoa
17:47 < zeroXten> ah thanks
17:47 < dho> rog: at some point i plan to replace the bash crap with
makefiles
17:47 < dho> rog: but the clean is there to get rid of possible improper
deps and stuff
17:48 < dho> i think
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17:48 < rog> dho: sure.  i had some weird redeclaration errors earlier which
were only solved with a make clean.  no dependencies had changed.
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17:55 < zeroXten> does regexp use preg or ereg?
17:56 < zeroXten> anything wrong with: ^([a-z]{16})[a-z]{32}$
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17:58 < zeroXten> bah, i'll use split instead
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19:42 < anticw> iant: are reads from maps considered sane w/o locking?
19:42 < anticw> s/sane/safe/
19:43 <+iant> anticw: yes, assuming that nothing can be writing to the map
at that time
19:47 < anticw> iant: that's no :)
19:48 <+iant> fair enough
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20:01 < clip9> what happens if a goroutine is wating for a channel.  and
that channel is closed in another goroutine?
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20:03 <+iant> clip9: a read will return with a zero value, a write will
simply return
20:03 < clip9> ok.  Thanks.
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20:40 < callidus> Hi, anyone here know much about any efforts towards go
graphics projects?  i.e.  OpenGL bindings ect?
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20:43 <+iant> callidus: I think you can find some stuff at
http://go-lang.cat-v.org/
20:44 < callidus> iant: ok thanks :-)
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20:45 < quag> callidus: someone mentioned X support
20:46 < callidus> thanks quag, there is an X11 backend of the exp/draw
package, but as it says in the docs its a "toy library"
20:46 < quag> ah
20:48 < callidus> i may have to have a look and see if there is somwhere i
can contribute some graphics code, im a games programmer by trade.  Though more of
a network guy than graphics tbh
20:48 < Kashia> there's also XCB
20:50 < callidus> ahh yes :-) thanks Kashia missed that one when i looked
20:50 < rog> is there a way of getting hg to print out all your current code
review issue numbers?
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20:51 < rog> i find myself going back to my emails and copy & pasting each
time...
20:54 < quag> here we go: http://go-lang.cat-v.org/library-bindings
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20:56 < keesj_> Hello
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20:56 < happy> hi
20:58 <+iant> rog: hg pending
21:00 < keesj_> I wonder how to package go and the std libs.
21:00 < keesj_> (debian package to run on maemo/n900)
21:01 < keesj_> I was plesantly supprised the 5g/l compiler produced hello
workd that work on that target !
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21:06 < callidus> keesj_: thats cool, go on more platforms is a plus ;-) no
idea about how to package it ect though
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21:07 < keesj_> it looks like I can compiles and copy the pkg/linux_arm
directory and put it somewhere else.
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21:10 < callidus> then you just need to point your $GOROOT at the right
place so things can find it, should work i guess
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21:15 < x10> Hey, if I make this in go:
21:15 < x10> "asdsad" + "ASDSDSA" + "dsadas" + myString + "ASDSAD"
21:15 < x10> is this bad, or very bad?
21:15 < x10> i.e.  Is it N^2
21:16 <+iant> I think the constants will be appended at compile time
21:16 < x10> I mean if they aren't constants
21:16 < x10> can I concatenate many things at once
21:16 < x10> or does it do them one at a time?
21:16 <+iant> ah.  I think currently it does them one at a time
21:17 < x10> :(
21:17 <+iant> x10: you might want to use strings.Join instead
21:18 < x10> will try
21:18 < x10> thanks
21:19 < dho> ugh what a horrible day
21:19 < dho> So: huge cold confirmed by doc, just have to keep warm and
drink a bunch of stuff
21:19 < dho> then I have to go pick up my rat-eaten car from insurance
21:19 < dho> I drop off the rental prius and they notice hood damage
21:20 < dho> I hadn't seen or noticed it; they open the hood and there's a
piece that's like crunched that pushes the hood over so it's not properly aligned
21:20 < dho> apparently there was work on the car before and i guess they
just didn't fix it properly
21:20 < dho> but oh my god at having to wait an hour to return a rental car
21:21 < dho> `luxeproblemen' as the dutch say i guess
21:22 < dho> oh.  they screwed up my clock too.
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21:25 < callidus> dho: yikes, sounds like loads of fun :-(
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21:39 < rog> iant: oh!  it does work...  i just never got past the "Loading
/161076/edit: urllib2.HTTPError: HTTP Error 404: Not Found; trying again in 2
seconds." error messages
21:46 < jhh> dho: ugh, sounds awful.  `luxeproblemen' as in `luxury
problems'?
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21:52 < pure_x01> new to go.  how does packages work.  i have a go file
called main.go that has a main package and a main method.  I also have a file
called config.go that has the package myapp ..config.go is located in a folder
also called myapp and this folder is paralell to main.go ..  the compiler says:
config.go:1: ...  package myapp; expected main
21:54 < Kashia> you first have to compile and install the pkg (myapp) before
you can import it and use it in a cmd (main)
21:54 < ShadowIce> did you try to compile them with the same [568]g call?
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21:58 < pure_x01> ShadowIce: yes
21:58 < pure_x01> Kashia: i havent imported it yet
21:58 < quag> Does anyone know of a io.Writer tee implementation?
21:59 < pure_x01> ShadowIce: i use the makefile provided by the go
distribution
21:59 < quag> Takes in two io.Writers and for each call to Write, calls
Write on both?
21:59 < keesj_> there is a turorial about a cat + rot13 . that sounds very
similar
22:00 < scoeri> does anybody know if there have been, or if there are, plans
to create a profiler for go?
22:00 < quag> keesj_: thanks
22:02 < ShadowIce> pure_x01: I haven't figured out how to use them correctly
with multiple non-main packages.  But from what I heard you have to use another
Makefile for myapp that the first one calls
22:03 < pure_x01> ShadowIce: oh i see..  thanx
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22:04 < ShadowIce> pure_x01:
http://code.google.com/p/gobuild/source/browse/Makefile (that's without an extra
Makefile, but as I said, I don't know if that's the correct way...but it works ;))
22:05 < keesj_> http://golang.org/doc/go_tutorial.html -> the Rotting
cats idea
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22:06 < pure_x01> ShadowIce: nice..  thanx alot for the example
22:06 < ShadowIce> np :)
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22:37 < jhh> I have a package in my project called "gb/parser".  Packaging
and linking works fine.  Then I add an "import go/parser" in one of the packages
and the linking breaks because of conflicting definitions of parser.  Anyone
encountered that one before?
22:38 < jhh> I guess I cannot have two packages with the same name in one
binary, even if their path is different?
22:38 < ShadowIce> yes...in two cases already ^^
22:38 < jhh> e.g.  gb/parser, go/parser
22:39 < jhh> I somehow expected the "nesting into directories" to prevent
that
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22:40 < scoeri> maybe if you give them a different name while importing
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22:40 < ShadowIce> did the linker crash or did you get a "good" error
message?
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22:43 < jhh> ShadowIce: I think it is a proper error message:
http://gopaste.org/view/N36j4
22:44 < ShadowIce> I somehow broke the linker once with two packages that
had the same name but were in different directories ^^
22:45 < jhh> works fine if i rename one package
22:46 < jhh> i renamed the package to gbparser and rename it on importing.
works as expected
22:47 < quag> Does anyone know how to create a temp file in Go?
22:47 < quag> I assume there is a way to use mkstemp or something similar
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22:53 < scoeri> jhh: thats a quite logical error then, because the default
name of a package upon importing is the name of the package and not the name of
the import path
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22:57 < jhh> scoeri: the names you use for imported packes cannot collide if
you do that in different files.  what collides are the names (ignoring its path)
of packages compiled in.  that's what i tried to say.
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