--- Log opened Fri Mar 19 00:00:29 2010 00:01 -!- no_mind [~orion@122.173.230.50] has joined #go-nuts 00:08 -!- nighty^ [~nighty@x122091.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has joined #go-nuts 00:11 < nf_> 'implode' ;) 00:11 < nf_> nasty phpism hehe 00:12 -!- bageera [~bageera@rrcs-24-173-161-170.se.biz.rr.com] has joined #go-nuts 00:15 -!- wuehlmaus [~wuehlmaus@p4FCC7E7D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:16 -!- wuehlmaus [~wuehlmaus@p4FCC7ECB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #go-nuts 00:19 -!- andrewh [~andrewh@94-194-56-42.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has joined #go-nuts 00:20 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #go-nuts 00:20 -!- g0bl1n_ [~pr0kter@a213-22-69-176.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #go-nuts 00:20 -!- SRabbelier [~SRabbelie@ip138-114-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #go-nuts 00:22 -!- kanru [~kanru@61-30-10-70.static.tfn.net.tw] has joined #go-nuts 00:34 -!- manveru1 [~manveru@b08s28ur.corenetworks.net] has left #go-nuts [] 00:40 < fuzzybyte> is there like a list of wrappers for go somewhere? 00:41 < fuzzybyte> ah nvm 00:43 < uriel> fuzzybyte: http://go-lang.cat-v.org/library-bindings 00:43 -!- _Ray_ [~Fede@190.18.152.15] has joined #go-nuts 00:43 < uriel> (this is in the process of probably moving to the new go wiki) 00:43 < _Ray_> What could I use if I was looking for arbitrary precision floats? 00:44 -!- hcatlin [~hcatlin@pdpc/supporter/professional/hcatlin] has joined #go-nuts 00:44 -!- hevalbaranov [~hevalbara@88.247.204.111] has joined #go-nuts 00:56 -!- c0nfl|ct [tiago@92.250.94.225] has quit [Quit: Saindo] 00:56 -!- Xera` [~brit@87-194-208-246.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.21 :: www.esnation.com )] 00:59 -!- bageera [~bageera@rrcs-24-173-161-170.se.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 01:00 -!- hcatlin [~hcatlin@pdpc/supporter/professional/hcatlin] has quit [Quit: hcatlin] 01:04 -!- hstimer [~hstimer@2002:465a:aa25:0:226:bbff:fe05:dd9b] has quit [Quit: hstimer] 01:05 < d_m> _Ray_: i'm pretty sure imprecision is built into the floating point model... i don't think arbitrary precision numbers are represented in floating point 01:09 -!- carllerche [~carllerch@enginey-9.border1.sfo002.pnap.net] has quit [Quit: carllerche] 01:09 < _Ray_> Float was maybe a bad term - arbitrary precision real numbers, in some internal representation (GMP uses strings) 01:15 < nf_> _Ray_: http://golang.org/pkg/bignum/ 01:19 -!- lloyda2 [~adam@arethusa-232.dynamic2.rpi.edu] has joined #go-nuts 01:25 -!- b00m_chef__ [~watr@128.189.77.147] has joined #go-nuts 01:25 -!- nighty^ [~nighty@x122091.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has quit [Quit: Disappears in a puff of smoke] 01:36 -!- nighty^ [~nighty@x122091.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has joined #go-nuts 01:39 < _Ray_> Says it'll become deprecated, but alright :) 01:40 < uriel> _Ray_: it says that it *may* be deprecated, not that it *will* be deprecated 01:51 -!- noldsel [1000@119.56.40.43] has joined #go-nuts 02:07 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:14 -!- brx [~brx@p5796FF55.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:16 -!- brx [~brx@p5796FE98.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #go-nuts 02:20 -!- hstimer [~hstimer@c-98-234-25-125.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #go-nuts 02:23 -!- nf_ [~nf@124-168-151-48.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:23 -!- nf [~nf@124-171-23-50.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #go-nuts 02:23 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:28 -!- g0bl1n_ [~pr0kter@a213-22-69-176.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:36 -!- lloyda2 [~adam@arethusa-232.dynamic2.rpi.edu] has quit [Quit: ""] 02:39 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has joined #go-nuts 02:45 -!- boscop [~boscop@f055062137.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #go-nuts 02:45 < boscop> hi 02:51 -!- andrewh [~andrewh@94-194-56-42.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:00 -!- brx [~brx@p5796FE98.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:03 -!- scarabx [~scarabx@c-76-19-43-200.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 03:03 -!- rhelmer_ [~rhelmer@adsl-69-107-95-216.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: rhelmer_] 03:07 -!- rhelmer [~rhelmer@adsl-69-107-95-216.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #go-nuts 03:07 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #go-nuts 03:10 -!- yashi [~yashi@dns1.atmark-techno.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:10 -!- rhelmer [~rhelmer@adsl-69-107-95-216.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Client Quit] 03:13 -!- yatoo [~marcus@host86-156-158-64.range86-156.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:13 -!- nf [~nf@124-171-23-50.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:13 -!- nf [~nf@124-171-32-30.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #go-nuts 03:15 -!- _Ray_ [~Fede@190.18.152.15] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:17 -!- kmeyer [~konrad@homer23.u.washington.edu] has joined #go-nuts 03:17 -!- kmeyer [~konrad@homer23.u.washington.edu] has quit [Changing host] 03:17 -!- kmeyer [~konrad@fedora/kmeyer] has joined #go-nuts 03:39 < yebyen> hello everybody 03:39 < yebyen> can someone tell me how to print a type's string? 03:43 < yebyen> name of the type as a string 03:43 < yebyen> or otherwise how to inspect it 03:44 < exch> a := 123; fmt.Printf("%T", a); => "int" 03:44 < yebyen> oh 03:44 < yebyen> nice 03:44 < yebyen> %T 03:44 -!- rhelmer [~rhelmer@adsl-69-107-95-216.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #go-nuts 03:44 < exch> there's also %v, %+v and %#v 03:45 < exch> useful to print contents of structures with field names 03:45 < yebyen> here i've got some *os.Dir and *os.PathError 03:45 < yebyen> cool 03:46 -!- yashi [~yashi@dns1.atmark-techno.com] has joined #go-nuts 03:54 < yebyen> and apparently nil does not have a type, or you ought to check for nil before you print %T 03:55 < yebyen> heh 03:55 -!- rhelmer [~rhelmer@adsl-69-107-95-216.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: rhelmer] 03:56 -!- carllerche [~carllerch@208.87.61.146] has joined #go-nuts 04:09 -!- b00m_chef__ [~watr@128.189.77.147] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:12 -!- noldsel [1000@119.56.40.43] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:14 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:18 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #go-nuts 04:23 -!- kssreeram [~kssreeram@122.174.65.150] has quit [Quit: kssreeram] 04:32 -!- hevalbaranov [~hevalbara@88.247.204.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:35 -!- hevalbaranov [~hevalbara@88.247.204.219] has joined #go-nuts 04:43 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:44 -!- carllerche [~carllerch@208.87.61.146] has quit [Quit: carllerche] 04:46 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #go-nuts 04:49 -!- robot12 [~robot12@szhilkin.broker.freenet6.net] has joined #go-nuts 04:58 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 04:58 -!- hevalbaranov [~hevalbara@88.247.204.219] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.2.6.3] 05:03 -!- robot12 [~robot12@szhilkin.broker.freenet6.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:04 -!- smw [~stephen@pool-96-232-88-231.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:40 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:45 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #go-nuts 06:00 -!- robot12 [~robot12@szhilkin.broker.freenet6.net] has joined #go-nuts 06:13 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:20 -!- no_mind [~orion@122.173.230.50] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:31 -!- TMKCodes [~toni@bbwirelessgw2-fee1dc00-62.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 06:33 -!- no_mind [~orion@122.163.245.72] has joined #go-nuts 06:33 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has joined #go-nuts 06:59 -!- path[l] [UPP@120.138.102.34] has joined #go-nuts 07:24 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:25 -!- m1ndwarp [~m1ndwarp@65-121.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #go-nuts 07:26 -!- bortzmeyer [~bortzmeye@batilda.nic.fr] has joined #go-nuts 07:29 -!- trickie [~trickie@94.100.112.225] has joined #go-nuts 07:42 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has joined #go-nuts 07:45 -!- ShadowIce [pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044] has joined #go-nuts 07:51 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:51 -!- path[l] [UPP@120.138.102.34] has quit [Quit: path[l]] 07:55 -!- rid1 [~rid1@119.30.34.29] has joined #go-nuts 07:58 -!- jajamana [~jcb@cm-84.215.40.160.getinternet.no] has joined #go-nuts 08:00 -!- jajamana [~jcb@cm-84.215.40.160.getinternet.no] has quit [Client Quit] 08:02 -!- rid1 [~rid1@119.30.34.29] has left #go-nuts [] 08:05 -!- Wiz126 [Wiz126@72.20.219.140] has joined #go-nuts 08:05 -!- ashaw [~alexis@58.108.161.163] has joined #go-nuts 08:05 < ashaw> hello. 08:05 < ashaw> anyone here? 08:05 < m1ndwarp> hi 08:05 < ashaw> does anyone know if there if a way to do FMA in go? 08:06 < m1ndwarp> whats fma? 08:06 < m1ndwarp> wikipedia tells me a lot of things that could be meant by fma :) 08:06 < ashaw> specificaly to get a+b=y*y all float64s 08:07 < ashaw> fused multiply add 08:08 -!- ikaros [~ikaros@f050225172.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #go-nuts 08:09 < m1ndwarp> erm... so fma is a thing that your machine should do like multiply accumulate? 08:09 < m1ndwarp> and compiler should see the chance to use it and put it in the assembly code? 08:10 < ashaw> yes but in this code it is different to mul + add 08:11 < ashaw> you can emulate it but it is about 20 times slower. 08:12 < m1ndwarp> mh... did you grep the library for fma? 08:12 < JBeshir> ashaw: I believe you should just write it out and if it is available, the compiler should use it. 08:13 < ashaw> how do you do that? 08:13 < ashaw> as I said it is not the same as a mul plus an add in this situation. 08:13 < m1ndwarp> I think so too, that should just be a job for the codeselection phase of compiler backend 08:14 < ashaw> yes, but what i want to know is how to write code such that that may be possible in the future. 08:16 < m1ndwarp> mh... a compiler usually builds a syntax tree and should be able to see in codeselection that the fma or whatever machine instruction can do a part of this tree very effectively 08:16 < m1ndwarp> so you shouldn't have to care about it 08:18 < m1ndwarp> of course it's good to analyze, what assembly code a compiler generates from which high level code to be able to write the code that performs best on the target machine 08:18 < JBeshir> ashaw: How is it different to a multiply + padd in this situation? 08:19 < m1ndwarp> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fused_multiply-add#Fused_multiply-add 08:19 < JBeshir> Reading that. 08:19 < JBeshir> How is it different for you? 08:19 < m1ndwarp> just a question of floating point stuff - where the floating points values get normalized, etc... 08:20 < JBeshir> That could be a difference, but only if Go makes guarantees about when rounding occurs. 08:20 < m1ndwarp> seems to be about precision and reducing the error 08:20 -!- mattikus [~mattikus@ip68-227-143-68.br.br.cox.net] has joined #go-nuts 08:20 < ashaw> as I said i want a+b = x*y 08:21 < ashaw> the equals is the importaint thing. 08:21 < m1ndwarp> ashaw: which of those are parameter and result? 08:21 < JBeshir> I'm not sure how that can work. 08:21 < ashaw> x, y are inputs 08:21 < JBeshir> It's... not an instruction. 08:21 < ashaw> no but you can get this by doing 08:21 < m1ndwarp> so, result is any pair of a and b that matches the equation? 08:22 < ashaw> no, b 08:22 < m1ndwarp> so a is input too 08:22 < ashaw> b<= 0.5 lsb(a) 08:22 < ashaw> no 08:22 < m1ndwarp> aaah, I understand 08:22 < ashaw> the code with a FMA is 08:22 < m1ndwarp> b is kind of an errorterm? 08:22 < ashaw> a=x*y 08:22 < ashaw> b=x*y-a 08:23 < ashaw> with a FMS 08:23 < m1ndwarp> ok 08:23 < JBeshir> If FMS exists, then you'd just write it like that, and the compiler would compile "x*y-a" into it when available. 08:23 < m1ndwarp> that really sounds like you need an optimized library to do this in one instruction 08:24 < JBeshir> If it didn't, you'd make it work in the compiler. 08:24 < ashaw> no, I NEED that garantee. 08:24 < ashaw> I can get it without it but it is vastly different code. 08:25 < m1ndwarp> mh... I think go is too experimental to give real guarantees... 08:25 -!- General1337 [~support@71-84-246-14.dhcp.gldl.ca.charter.com] has joined #go-nuts 08:25 < JBeshir> Does Go give guarantees about rounding in general? 08:25 < JBeshir> IRT "when it happens"? 08:26 -!- wrtp [~rog@89.241.218.64] has joined #go-nuts 08:26 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has joined #go-nuts 08:26 < JBeshir> A big fun thing in C was floating points not equaling identical floating points because the processor was allowed to store more precision in registers, or something, I thought. 08:26 < ashaw> IEEE-754 arithmetic is garanteed. 08:28 < JBeshir> Sounds like you might need a library, then, since it'd have to implement another way to do it when the FMA instruction wasn't available. 08:28 -!- yatoo [~marcus@host86-156-158-64.range86-156.btcentralplus.com] has joined #go-nuts 08:28 < ashaw> question where is the go pastebin 08:28 < guaqua> one hasn't been written in go? 08:29 < guaqua> are there even any bots here? 08:29 < JBeshir> ashaw: "When converting a number to a floating-point or complex type, the result value is rounded to the precision specified by the destination type. For instance, the value of a variable x of type float32 may be stored using additional precision beyond that of an IEEE-754 32-bit number" 08:29 -!- General13372 [~support@71-84-246-14.dhcp.gldl.ca.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:29 < JBeshir> (But float32(x) rounds it to normal size, is how that ends) 08:29 < ashaw> ah. 08:30 < ashaw> I did ask this question on the mailing list and was told that arithmatic was performed in float64 precision for float64 variables 08:32 -!- kaigan|work [~kaigan@c-8290e255.1411-10-64736c14.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #go-nuts 08:32 < ashaw> the code that i have to do this is the following currently 08:32 < ashaw> Procedure for Multiplying two double precision floating point 08:32 < ashaw> numbers giving a Double-Double result 08:32 < ashaw> Arguments: Two double numbers, u and v 08:32 < ashaw> Results: a double double number rh, rl 08:32 < ashaw> Preconditions: u < 2^970 08:32 < ashaw> v < 2^970 08:32 < ashaw> Guarantees: rh = o(u * v) 08:32 < ashaw> rl = (u * v) - rh 08:32 < ashaw> rh + rl = u * v 08:32 < ashaw> |rl|≤ 2^(-53)*|rh| 08:32 < ashaw> */ 08:32 < ashaw> func Mul12(u float64, v float64) (rh float64, rl float64) { 08:32 < ashaw> const c = 134217729. // 1+2^27 08:32 < ashaw> var up, u1, u2, vp, v1, v2 float64 08:32 < ashaw> up = u * c 08:32 < ashaw> vp = v * c 08:33 < ashaw> u1 = (u - up) + up 08:33 < ashaw> v1 = (v - vp) + vp 08:33 < ashaw> u2 = u - u1 08:33 < ashaw> v2 = v - v1 08:33 < ashaw> rh = u * v 08:33 < ashaw> rl = (((u1*v1 - rh) + (u1 * v2)) + (u2 * v1)) + (u2 * v2) 08:33 < ashaw> return 08:33 < ashaw> } 08:34 -!- path[l] [~path@122.182.0.38] has joined #go-nuts 08:35 < ashaw> any responce? 08:39 -!- ct529 [~quassel@77-44-78-159.xdsl.murphx.net] has joined #go-nuts 08:40 -!- nf_ [~nf@124-171-242-24.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #go-nuts 08:40 -!- nf [~nf@124-171-32-30.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:43 < ashaw> also how does one access the inexact flag? 08:46 -!- 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#go-nuts 12:10 -!- fusion44 [~quassel@p5B28488F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:10 -!- path[l] [~path@59.162.86.164] has quit [Quit: path[l]] 12:28 -!- ashaw [~alexis@58.108.161.163] has joined #go-nuts 12:34 -!- awidegreen_ [~quassel@p5B061E1C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:39 -!- cchengz [~Changchen@115.131.38.18] has joined #go-nuts 12:39 -!- cchengz [~Changchen@115.131.38.18] has left #go-nuts [] 12:44 -!- arun__ [~arun@212-123-133-164.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:46 -!- exch [~nuada@h144170.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #go-nuts 12:46 -!- ahihi [~generic@cs27127176.pp.htv.fi] has joined #go-nuts 12:59 -!- ashaw [~alexis@58.108.161.163] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:00 -!- OpenSpace [~ja@79.101.94.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:04 -!- nanoo [~nano@95-89-189-46-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #go-nuts 13:05 -!- nf [~nf@124-168-145-44.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:05 -!- nf [~nf@124-171-31-181.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #go-nuts 13:06 -!- meanburrito920_ [~john@unaffiliated/meanburrito920] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:08 < KnightMage> I've seen the videos and Go looks very promising. One question though, what's wrong with D Programming Language? It has garbage collection and a lot of features. 13:09 < KnightMage> By D, I mean this language: http://www.digitalmars.com/d/ 13:10 < m1ndwarp> KnightMage: does it also support multithreading, closures, shared memory and messagepassing? 13:10 < JBeshir> Is it also simple? 13:11 < JBeshir> I think D shares the "Static, compiled, high performance" goals, but makes a lot of different design decisions. 13:11 < KnightMage> m1ndwarp, It does have multithreading, but I have looked at multithreading aspects of it very much. 13:12 < exch> there's bound to be a lot of languages out there that share a lot of functionality with Go, but i'm guessing each of them missed something vital enough to warrent the creation of a new one 13:12 < JBeshir> Goroutines are not quite multithreading. 13:12 -!- souffledev [~soufflede@110-174-144-249.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #go-nuts 13:13 < m1ndwarp> JBeshir: I'd call it asynchronous multithreading 13:13 < KnightMage> JBeshir, yeah, I am still reading up on goroutins. I need to understand them better in order to make comparisons. :) 13:13 < JBeshir> m1ndwarp: What's asynchronous as opposed to? 13:14 -!- chickamade [~chickamad@113.190.187.215] has joined #go-nuts 13:14 -!- OpenSpace [~ja@91.150.125.194] has joined #go-nuts 13:15 < m1ndwarp> JBeshir: I mean the concept behind blocks & libdispatch... like using closures (coroutines) and dispatching them to free threads 13:15 < m1ndwarp> from code that nearly looks like the one which would do this stuff without parallelism 13:15 < KnightMage> exch, yeah. D was started sometime in 2000, so it's fairly new and I was curious as to what it lacked that warrented the need for Go. I was curious about the differences between the two. 13:15 < m1ndwarp> it's not all about multithreading in one program but about distribution and performance in multi-job scenarios 13:16 < exch> I've never used D, so I can't really answer that 13:16 < KnightMage> D is really the only new language that I know of that compiles to binary code rather than needed a VM like C# and Java. 13:16 <+iant> I don't know D all that well, but it seems to take a quite different approach from Go 13:16 < JBeshir> KnightMage: At a quick look, Go explicitly has decided that function overloading, metaprogramming, resizable arrays, object orientation, operator overloading, are bad things. 13:16 <+iant> D is sort of like a fixed C++ 13:17 <+iant> Go started from scratch, threw out every feature, and only put in what seemed necessary 13:17 <+iant> D is a much bigger language than Go 13:17 < m1ndwarp> to me go seems more like a programming language for smaller, but very performing applications/servers 13:18 < KnightMage> m1ndwarp, then what are multithreads in one app still called goroutines? 13:18 < taruti> is there any reason go type system was made so primitive? 13:18 < JBeshir> taruti: Deliberate simplicity. 13:18 < m1ndwarp> not like big languages offering the features JBeshir mentioned 13:18 < guaqua> KnightMage: goroutines are not threads 13:18 < m1ndwarp> KnightMage: as guaqua just said :) 13:18 < m1ndwarp> goroutines are closures which are executed by threads 13:18 < KnightMage> iant, I see your point. D started out with C as a base and then fixed what was wrong with C. 13:18 < guaqua> they are something like processes in erlang 13:18 < JBeshir> taruti: No time spent creating, defining, and, inevitably, redefining over and over, object hierarchies 13:18 < KnightMage> ahhhh. 13:19 < JBeshir> m1ndwarp: Goroutines are functions executed by threads. 13:19 < JBeshir> Not just closures. 13:19 < KnightMage> Sorry, I am still in C++ mode with threads and mutexes and all those fun things. :) 13:19 < JBeshir> Pretty sure "go func(x)" does not behave like a closure. 13:19 < taruti> JBeshir: I'm not meaning object hierarchies, but coming from a statically typed fp background go type system looks quite oversimplified. 13:19 < m1ndwarp> JBeshir: ok, right, but they are allowed to be closures (closures are special functions) 13:20 < JBeshir> m1ndwarp: Right; through closures being a subset of functions. 13:21 < KnightMage> So, then goroutines are very more powerful since they are a function executed in a thread that is is taken care of for you rather than manually se?tting up the thread and giving it something to do like in C++, ie more room for errors in the C++ way 13:21 -!- dilenger [~dilenger@124-171-12-229.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #go-nuts 13:21 < JBeshir> KnightMage: No. 13:21 < KnightMage> ah 13:21 < JBeshir> Goroutines are more powerful because they *aren't* threads. 13:22 < JBeshir> They're very very lightweight, as well as being easy. 13:22 < m1ndwarp> it costs very few to change context between goroutines 13:22 < guaqua> powerful in this case is hard to define 13:22 < KnightMage> Ahha. 13:22 < JBeshir> The only real cost for each is the stack, and because Go uses segmented stacks, I think that gives each goroutine about 4KB memory cost. 13:22 < guaqua> but they are a whole lot simpler 13:22 < JBeshir> They're handled as coroutines, multiplexed across a configurable number of OS threads 13:23 < JBeshir> With a new thread automatically created and the goroutine pushed onto it when one needs to block. 13:23 < dagle> goroutines can be seens as threads to, depending what you call threads. 13:23 < m1ndwarp> dagle: of course a question of definition :) 13:24 -!- iant [~iant@adsl-71-133-8-30.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 13:24 < JBeshir> Due to the low cost, you can use them as a means to achieve threading very easily by breaking problems up across a number of goroutines suiting the problem; most notably for me, you can use them to do all I/O synchronously 13:24 < JBeshir> Without the massive massive overhead of having a thread per connection or similar. 13:24 < KnightMage> Hmmm. I like that it's a very small amount of cost. It seems like a lot of languages are under the impression that since there is more ram in today's system, let's use, which makes the program slow. <_< 13:24 < JBeshir> Yeah, I hate that too. 13:25 < taruti> to be fair "threads" in many languages are implemented like go go-routines. 13:25 < vegai> taruti: oh, hi. 13:25 * m1ndwarp thinks so too 13:25 < taruti> vegai: hello 13:25 < KnightMage> So, programs today just run slowly even on todays systems. I can understand why Go is perfect for servers now. Less memory means more users can connect and have a fast session. 13:25 < vegai> except that most other languages don't multiplex to actual os threads 13:26 -!- Fraeon [~kzer-za@e212-246-65-153.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #go-nuts 13:26 < m1ndwarp> KnightMage: and you can make a goroutine answering every request 13:26 < m1ndwarp> which doesn't cost much 13:26 < taruti> vegai: e.g. GHC (haskell) and Erlang do that. 13:26 < vegai> taruti: true, they do. 13:26 < JBeshir> Yeah, I don't think anyone claimed it was a unique feature. 13:26 < JBeshir> <distracted>You know what would be really cool? 13:27 < vegai> although ghc (at least 6.10) had some quite rough costs when building with -threaded 13:27 < JBeshir> If Go's compiler looked at the function called when starting a goroutine 13:27 < vegai> memory consumption explodes etc... 13:27 < JBeshir> And if it made no other function calls, arranged for it to be allocated only the stack it needs for that function. 13:27 < taruti> vegai: memory consumption exploding sounds like a bug. 13:27 < KnightMage> Which is another huge advantage. The differences are becoming very clear now. :) Thanks for answering my questions all. 13:28 < taruti> resource limited go-routines with an error handling mechanism would be a very cool addition to the language. 13:28 < JBeshir> KnightMage: My personal view is that Go focuses on simplicity, ease of writing, ease of reading code and being sure it is safe, and ease of maintenance. 13:28 < vegai> taruti: I mean, the cost of each thread is much higher. You could call it a performance bug 13:28 < KnightMage> vegai, I believe that. http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/ Shows how much it explodes. :P They even have Go code put to the speed test. Nice benchmark for languages. 13:28 < m1ndwarp> JBeshir: I think it took care of making an abstraction for the right set of features 13:28 < m1ndwarp> I love the channel model 13:29 < JBeshir> KnightMage: And decides that OO has an unacceptable overhead. 13:29 < m1ndwarp> and closures are really useful sometimes instread of designing objects 13:29 < JBeshir> As well as taking a pragmatic and sensible approach to executing fast as opposed to the "throw it all in a blender" approach to implmenting features in most languages. 13:29 < KnightMage> JBeshir, I think Go code is very easy to read. Normally I find other's code hard to read, but I can follow all Go code that I have seen so far, I went through the source of Go to get a better understanding of it. 13:29 -!- scarabx [~scarabx@c-76-19-43-200.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #go-nuts 13:30 < JBeshir> KnightMage: That's awesome. 13:30 < JBeshir> My experience was that I flailed around a bit as normal in a new language, a little "WTF is this", then realised I'd hit bottom and there was actually no more complexity or dark corners to learn. 13:30 < taruti> KnightMage: for some hard to read code look at e.g. gob 13:30 < JBeshir> I personally like it a lot, mildly annoyed I've not had an opportunity to use it for anything substantial yet. 13:31 < KnightMage> JBeshir, that just shows that that part of developing Go was a success! C++, Java, and Perl can be so difficult to read when you look at other's code. 13:31 < m1ndwarp> KnightMage: the thing about no pointer arithmetic is also very good for code-readability 13:32 < m1ndwarp> besides the fact that it makes the result more safe :) 13:32 < KnightMage> taruti, I have my fair share of bad code trying to fix other people's blunders. It takes hours to trace their code sometimes. 13:32 < JBeshir> KnightMage: I find simplicity (the balance between it and features seems like elegance would be a better term, because an overly simple language does lead to evil constructs) makes things much more readable, as well as their decision to omit various features. 13:32 -!- chickamade [~chickamad@113.190.187.215] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:32 < JBeshir> Perhaps it'd be better if some of the deliberately considered and denied things has "Does not have X" listed as a feature. :P 13:33 < KnightMage> m1ndwarp, I can read some pointer arithmatic, but sometimes it does get a bit out of hand and over used in places where it's not needed, and it's like WTF, why is it used there? 13:33 < taruti> pointer arithmetic is not typically quite readable. concurrency related things when not documented can be very bad. 13:33 < m1ndwarp> KnightMage: sometimes it made sense to fasten the code, but compilers can do even better nowadays :) 13:34 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has joined #go-nuts 13:34 < taruti> "is this locking discipline really safe against various kinds of issues" 13:34 < KnightMage> JBeshir, you are right there. In the hour long presentation on Go on Youtube, they show an example with foo.foo some variablbe ..... when in Go, it was really short and nice. :) 13:35 < KnightMage> m1ndwarp, true. I guess people get in a certain way writing because of the way compilers use to be and haven't changed their style when better compilers have come out. 13:36 < m1ndwarp> although it's still useful to know what assembly code compilers create, I think 13:36 < m1ndwarp> just to be able to work with the compiler, not against it 13:37 -!- tibshoot_ [~tibshoot@linagora-230-146.pr0.nerim.net] has joined #go-nuts 13:37 -!- tibshoot [~tibshoot@linagora-230-146.pr0.nerim.net] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 13:38 < KnightMage> taruti, I read code and form the image in my head of what it's doing, so I can follow pointer arithmatic, but I don't like it. It uses a lot of brain power to follow it and keep it strait. 13:38 < taruti> KnightMage: true. but it is usually quite localized. 13:39 -!- ShadowIce` [pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044] has joined #go-nuts 13:39 -!- michael| [~maikeru@unaffiliated/maikeru/x-7708887] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:39 < KnightMage> m1ndwarp, I agree with that. I was having that discussion with someone about that the other day. The conclusion was that it's still good to know how to do assembly and all the stuff that libraries do for us so that knowledge is not lost. 13:40 -!- ShadowIce [pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044] has quit [Ping timeout: 269 seconds] 13:41 < KnightMage> Something I have been thinking about when I saw the Go videos, would it be possible to write a kernel in Go, I mean an actual kernel like GNU/Linux is a kernel. 13:41 -!- brx [~brx@p4FEE7CA4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #go-nuts 13:41 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:41 < taruti> KnightMage: yes. (with some helpers) 13:41 < m1ndwarp> I think so too 13:42 < bortzmeyer> KnightMage: this requires a bit of assembly (for instance, you cannot save/restore the state of a process in Go). And Go has no interface to assembly. 13:42 < JBeshir> Pretty sure you can compile assembly stuff in with Go. 13:42 < KnightMage> hmmm 13:42 < JBeshir> Some parts of the language work that way, don't they? 13:42 -!- michael| [~maikeru@unaffiliated/maikeru/x-7708887] has joined #go-nuts 13:42 < JBeshir> In implementation. 13:42 < JBeshir> C, if not assembly. 13:42 -!- Xera^ [~brit@87-194-208-246.bethere.co.uk] has joined #go-nuts 13:43 < m1ndwarp> JBeshir: afaik yes 13:43 < m1ndwarp> just look in the source folder 13:43 < KnightMage> Well, you might need to do some parts out of Go, but, would there be any benefit to a kernel written in a language that garbage collects? I guess it would never memory leak? 13:43 < taruti> bortzmeyer: Go has an interface with assembly actually. 13:43 < m1ndwarp> for example in pkg/bignum there is some assembly in *.s 13:44 < m1ndwarp> and c in pkg/syscall 13:45 < JBeshir> The only feature I really really wish I had is shared objects, because I like runtime reloadable modules in software. 13:45 < KnightMage> I got the feeling when watching the video that Google might want to write everything in Go, including an OS with a kernel in Go. 13:45 < JBeshir> (gccgo doesn't count until it implements the rest of Go) 13:46 < taruti> JBeshir: are they really that important? 13:46 < JBeshir> taruti: Yes. 13:46 < m1ndwarp> KnightMage: I thought it was mostly about server infrastructure 13:46 < m1ndwarp> but I guess there will be kernel modules 13:46 < KnightMage> Is shared objects just a not completed yet feature or one that will not be in Go at all? 13:46 < m1ndwarp> which support the usage of goroutines over multiple apps 13:46 < JBeshir> KnightMage: It's compiler-specific 13:46 < taruti> JBeshir: most of time they seem like a bad fit. 13:47 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #go-nuts 13:47 < KnightMage> ah 13:47 < JBeshir> taruti: If you never want to make the featureset of your software configurable without recompiling it, then sure. 13:47 < KnightMage> Will the 6G and 8G compilers ever impliment them then? 13:47 < JBeshir> Or, more importantly for me, the ability to reload most of the program on the fly for update. 13:47 -!- vegai [vegai@archlinux/developer/vegai] has left #go-nuts [] 13:47 < taruti> JBeshir: of course I can have that without dynamic loading. 13:48 < JBeshir> taruti: In Go? 13:48 < JBeshir> KnightMage: I don't think they will. However, gccgo will presumably get more mature eventually. 13:49 < taruti> JBeshir: running plugins as separate processes works fine (and gives more control over buggy plugins) and there is the "fork-exec a new version of the program and give it the state serialized" 13:49 < JBeshir> Separate processes is unbelievably fat and slow 13:49 < taruti> in-process things hinder optimization and make things break more easily 13:50 < KnightMage> JBeshir, I hope they add that in to the *G compilers because they are very fast at compiling. 13:50 < JBeshir> "hinder optimisation" is kinda irrelevant when the alternative is incredibly expensive in both memory and CPU. 13:50 < JBeshir> Every hook involving a context switch 13:50 < JBeshir> No, you could not implement "most of the program" that way for reloading on the fly. 13:51 < taruti> JBeshir: of course if you require very frequent switches you might look into how your program is designed. 13:52 < JBeshir> taruti: Or it needs to maintain unbroken but wants new features to be developed. 13:52 < taruti> (we have hot upgrading for some Haskell things with the fork-exec-with-serialized-state and it works fine) 13:52 < exch> I'm facing this exact problem right now with my irc bot. The plugin system is turning out to be most effective when lpugins are run as independant processes. I'm still trying to determine how this can be made most useful 13:52 < JBeshir> Fork-exec-with-serialised-state could be practical, if just painful. 13:53 < KnightMage> brb breakfast time 13:53 < taruti> JBeshir: handling versioned data structures is much more painful without serialization 13:53 < JBeshir> taruti: I'm sure. 13:54 -!- scarabx [~scarabx@c-76-19-43-200.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 13:54 < JBeshir> It'd still need a rebuild-from-source by the user of the software to enable/disable modules without the quite horrible overhead of running them in separate processes, though. 13:54 < taruti> most of the time I actually prefer the performance hit if I can control the resource usage of those plugins 13:55 < exch> keeping the user-code in independant of the program is probably worth any reasonable performance hit when you consider safety and stability. 13:56 < JBeshir> It isn't reasonable. 13:56 < exch> having a dodgy pluging loaded into the main process and causing havoc just isn't very practical 13:56 < exch> *plugin 13:56 -!- ShadowIce` [pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 13:57 < exch> I'm curious to see some performance tests on this though 13:58 < taruti> if it is crucial to performance it probably could be statically compiled and get the benefits of inlining etc 13:58 < JBeshir> And lose the benefits of being configurable in presence and reloadable in the first place. 13:58 < JBeshir> And... you shouldn't need to see performance tests to know that a context switch for every hook call, for every module, for every possible event to hook on, could be more than a little expensive. 13:59 < JBeshir> Especially given scheduling wouldn't transfer context to the right process immediately 13:59 < taruti> if you have just invasive plugins then most probably something is wrong with the architecture :) 13:59 < JBeshir> Now let's say this plugin needs to be able to control permissions... 14:00 < JBeshir> Or some other instance in which the core *must* block on it. 14:00 < JBeshir> And cannot proceed to the next plugin until it is done. And so. 14:00 < JBeshir> Now you're waiting for the scheduler to schedule each process before you can move onto the next, and doing this for every plugin. 14:00 < taruti> permission checking needs typically be placed into places that are *not* on the hot path 14:02 < JBeshir> Which places you in the entertaining position of precalculating permission checks for everything the user could possibly do ahead of time, or some sort of memoisation approach that leaves it vulnerable to a performance hit by users deliberately running through all the possibilities? 14:03 < JBeshir> s/the user/every user/ 14:03 -!- iant [~iant@67.218.102.143] has joined #go-nuts 14:03 -!- mode/#go-nuts [+v iant] by ChanServ 14:04 < taruti> JBeshir: not really. Typically access rights need to be checked on the first access and not on every subsequent access. 14:05 -!- robot12 [~robot12@szhilkin.broker.freenet6.net] has quit [Quit: Ухожу я от вас (xchat 2.4.5 или старше)] 14:08 -!- m1ndwarp [~m1ndwarp@65-121.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Quit: m1ndwarp] 14:10 -!- g0bl1n [~anonymous@a213-22-69-176.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:16 -!- brx [~brx@p4FEE7CA4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 14:19 -!- Fraeon [~kzer-za@e212-246-65-153.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:19 -!- ct529_ [~quassel@77-44-78-159.xdsl.murphx.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:20 -!- Fraeon [~kzer-za@e212-246-65-153.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #go-nuts 14:23 -!- cmarcelo [~cmarcelo@200.184.118.130] has joined #go-nuts 14:23 -!- cmarcelo [~cmarcelo@200.184.118.130] has quit [Changing host] 14:23 -!- cmarcelo [~cmarcelo@enlightenment/developer/cmarcelo] has joined #go-nuts 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Fraeon [~kzer-za@e212-246-65-153.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Quit: Fraeon] 15:06 -!- Xera^ [~brit@87-194-208-246.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:06 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:08 -!- kaigan|work_ [~kaigan@c-8290e255.1411-10-64736c14.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: kaigan|work_] 15:11 -!- hstimer [~hstimer@c-98-234-25-125.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: hstimer] 15:12 -!- Fraeon [~kzer-za@e212-246-65-153.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #go-nuts 15:13 -!- OpenSpace [~ja@109.92.239.111] has joined #go-nuts 15:15 -!- dilenger [~dilenger@124-171-12-229.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 15:17 -!- meanburrito920_ [~john@unaffiliated/meanburrito920] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:22 -!- souffledev [~soufflede@110-174-144-249.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Quit: <>] 15:22 -!- meanburrito920_ [~john@unaffiliated/meanburrito920] has joined #go-nuts 15:23 -!- meanburrito920_ [~john@unaffiliated/meanburrito920] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:24 -!- meanburrito920_ [~john@unaffiliated/meanburrito920] has joined #go-nuts 15:24 -!- iant [~iant@nat/google/x-mgtmpxsewmetrfal] has joined #go-nuts 15:24 -!- mode/#go-nuts [+v iant] by ChanServ 15:29 -!- zeroXten_ [~zeroXten@0x10.co.uk] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:29 -!- john280z [~jmitchell@static-71-120-222-85.rlghnc.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #go-nuts 15:29 -!- zeroXten [~zeroXten@0x10.co.uk] has joined #go-nuts 15:29 < boscop> when inheritance is implicit, the compiler has to test each type (class) for each available interface, right? so, quadratic time. 15:31 <+iant> I missed the start: in what scenario does the compiler need to test each type against each interface? 15:33 < boscop> the FAQ says: "Rather than requiring the programmer to declare ahead of time that two types are related, in Go a type automatically satisfies any interface that specifies a subset of its methods." 15:33 -!- crashR [~crasher@codextreme.pck.nerim.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:33 <+iant> that is true, but it does not follow that the compiler must test each type against each interface 15:33 <+iant> the compiler only has to test when the program converts a type to an interface 15:33 < boscop> ok 15:34 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has joined #go-nuts 15:34 -!- crashR [~crasher@codextreme.pck.nerim.net] has joined #go-nuts 15:35 < ThunderChicken> "Can they do this?" is an easier question than "What could they do?" 15:37 -!- wrtp [~rog@89.241.218.64] has quit [Quit: wrtp] 15:39 -!- wrtp [~rog@89.241.218.64] has joined #go-nuts 15:44 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:44 -!- skelterjohn [~jasmuth@c-76-124-23-95.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:47 -!- TMKCodes [~toni@bbwirelessgw2-fee1dc00-62.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #go-nuts 15:52 -!- Venom_X [~pjacobs@99.3.159.249] has joined #go-nuts 15:54 -!- hstimer [~hstimer@2002:465a:aa25:0:226:bbff:fe05:dd9b] has joined #go-nuts 16:13 -!- meanburrito920_ [~john@unaffiliated/meanburrito920] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:16 -!- KnightMage [~jon@host86-146-113-221.range86-146.btcentralplus.com] has left #go-nuts ["Konversation terminated!"] 16:18 -!- m1ndwarp_ [~m1ndwarp@xdsl-78-35-132-239.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: m1ndwarp_] 16:25 < anticw> iant: speaking of which, when you pass type T into something expected interface I, i see call into the runtime 16:25 < anticw> iant: it's not clear why these are necessary 16:26 < JBeshir> Does it happen every time, or just the first? 16:27 < anticw> in the calling sites for each call 16:27 < anticw> anyhow, for something expecting interface{} i wonder if there isn't some optimization possible 16:30 -!- trickie [~trickie@94.100.112.225] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:32 -!- meanburrito920_ [~john@unaffiliated/meanburrito920] has joined #go-nuts 16:32 -!- bortzmeyer [~bortzmeye@batilda.nic.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:33 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has joined #go-nuts 16:34 -!- nanoo [~nano@95-89-189-46-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:45 -!- warthurton [~warthurto@pdpc/supporter/active/warthurton] has joined #go-nuts 16:45 -!- ikaros [~ikaros@f050225172.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #go-nuts 16:49 -!- m1ndwarp [~m1ndwarp@dynamic-unidsl-85-197-29-20.westend.de] has joined #go-nuts 16:55 < wrtp> anticw: see src/pkg/runtime/iface.c:/^itab to see what goes on underneath 16:57 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:02 -!- KnightMage [~jon@host86-146-113-221.range86-146.btcentralplus.com] has joined #go-nuts 17:07 -!- trickie [~trickie@86.93.227.181] has joined #go-nuts 17:08 -!- trickie [~trickie@86.93.227.181] has quit [Client Quit] 17:16 <+iant> anticw: yes, some optimization is possible 17:20 -!- brx [~brx@p4FEE7CA4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 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seconds] 17:41 -!- KnightMage [~jon@host86-146-113-221.range86-146.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:43 -!- dizm [~dizm@121.98.168.127] has left #go-nuts [] 17:50 -!- g0bl1n [~anonymous@a213-22-18-86.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #go-nuts 17:56 -!- carllerche [~carllerch@enginey-9.border1.sfo002.pnap.net] has joined #go-nuts 18:10 -!- andrewh [~andrewh@94-194-56-42.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has joined #go-nuts 18:13 -!- tibshoot_ [~tibshoot@linagora-230-146.pr0.nerim.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:15 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:17 -!- andrewh [~andrewh@94-194-56-42.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:18 < anticw> wrtp: i know what's going on, but the most common case often is interface{} which could be optimized 18:33 -!- arun_ [~arun@unaffiliated/sindian] has joined #go-nuts 18:37 -!- cmarcelo [~cmarcelo@enlightenment/developer/cmarcelo] has quit [Ping timeout: 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http://is.gd/aPfYP by [Fumitoshi Ukai] in go/src/pkg/websocket/ -- websocket: use URL.RawPath to construct WebSocket-Location: header 21:26 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPfZ8 by [Ken Thompson] in go/src/cmd/6c/ -- issue 608 21:27 -!- guaqua [gua@lakka.kapsi.fi] has left #go-nuts [] 21:34 -!- grahame [~grahame@billy.angrygoats.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:45 -!- grahame [~grahame@billy.angrygoats.net] has joined #go-nuts 21:50 -!- ampleyfly_ [ampleyfly@2002:55e5:8e6b::55e5:8e6b] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:50 -!- ampleyfly_ [ampleyfly@c-6b8ee555.09-36-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #go-nuts 21:57 -!- nanoo [~nano@95-89-189-46-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #go-nuts 22:00 -!- nanooo [~nano@95-89-189-46-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:04 -!- Rint__ [john@static-71-244-60-125.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #go-nuts 22:05 -!- k4jd095b_ [~k4jd095b@87.70.183.61] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:05 -!- k4jd095b_ [~k4jd095b@87.70.183.61] has joined #go-nuts 22:07 -!- path[l] [UPP@120.138.102.34] has joined #go-nuts 22:07 -!- nanoo [~nano@95-89-189-46-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:13 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPjuB by [Rob Pike] in go/src/ -- Factor the Makefiles to make writing outside Makefiles easier. 22:13 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPjuK by [Alex Brainman] in 2 subdirs of go/src/pkg/ -- syscall: mksyscall_mingw.sh emitting shorter calls (to Syscall or Syscall6) when there are fewer arguments 22:22 -!- meanburrito920_ [~john@unaffiliated/meanburrito920] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:25 -!- scm [justme@d019132.adsl.hansenet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 22:29 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPkAd by [Robert Griesemer] in 2 subdirs of go/ -- godoc: show (some) line numbers for remote search 22:29 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPkAi by [Alex Brainman] in go/src/pkg/syscall/ -- syscall: mingw implemntation of Errstr() 22:29 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPkAE by [Charles L. Dorian] in go/src/pkg/math/ -- math: add Gamma function 22:31 -!- scm [justme@c190233.adsl.hansenet.de] has joined #go-nuts 22:37 -!- kanru [~kanru@61-228-158-15.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #go-nuts 22:38 -!- meanburrito920_ [~john@unaffiliated/meanburrito920] has joined #go-nuts 22:38 -!- willwh [~quassel@S010600c09f8af75a.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #go-nuts 22:38 -!- willwh [~quassel@S010600c09f8af75a.gv.shawcable.net] has quit [Changing host] 22:38 -!- willwh [~quassel@unaffiliated/willskills] has joined #go-nuts 22:41 -!- gnuvince [~vince@64.235.207.53] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 22:42 -!- m1ndwarp [~m1ndwarp@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has quit [Quit: m1ndwarp] 22:56 -!- ni|_ [~james@dontpanic.union.edu] has left #go-nuts [] 22:57 -!- ni| [~james@dontpanic.union.edu] has joined #go-nuts 22:57 < ni|> can someone explain what gofmt -w <file> does? 22:57 < ni|> russ asked me to run it 22:57 < ni|> and idk what it does 22:57 < ni|> http://codereview.appspot.com/589043/show 22:57 < ni|> does he want me to start over 22:57 <+iant> it runs gofmt on a file and rewrites the file with the formatted contents 22:57 < exch> it reformats content of <file> and replaces content in file with new content 22:58 < KirkMcDonald> http://golang.org/cmd/gofmt/ 22:59 < ni|> iant: yes i see that 22:59 -!- iant [~iant@nat/google/x-mgtmpxsewmetrfal] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:59 -!- The_Cog [~chatzilla@i-195-137-123-15.freedom2surf.net] has joined #go-nuts 22:59 < ni|> whoops he left 22:59 < ni|> i just don't know if he mains to do it instead of 23:00 < ni|> like should i start over 23:00 < ni|> or just run gofmt -w 23:00 < ni|> like he suggested 23:00 -!- iant [~iant@nat/google/x-cvjzxdfcakrfally] has joined #go-nuts 23:00 -!- mode/#go-nuts [+v iant] by ChanServ 23:00 < KirkMcDonald> ni|: Run it on your edited source file. 23:00 < ni|> iant: did russ mean to start over or just run that command and resubmit with hg change ; hg mail 23:00 < ni|> KirkMcDonald: i've already done this 23:00 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPmzQ by [Russ Cox] in go/ -- A+C: add James Toy (individual CLA) 23:01 <+iant> he just meant to reformat the file using gofmt 23:01 < ni|> figured 23:01 < ni|> ok thanks 23:01 <+iant> and then run hg mail again 23:01 < ni|> plexdev: yes? 23:01 <+iant> (you don't need to run hg change again) 23:01 < ni|> iant: kk 23:01 < ni|> iant: sorry i'm dumb :P 23:01 < ni|> just new to the codereview app 23:01 -!- Xera` [~brit@87-194-208-246.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:02 -!- iant [~iant@nat/google/x-cvjzxdfcakrfally] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:02 -!- iant [~iant@nat/google/x-wfvzdpcmaqdqbkgs] has joined #go-nuts 23:02 -!- mode/#go-nuts [+v iant] by ChanServ 23:03 < ni|> iant: so the codereview software knows i've modified the file 23:03 < ni|> after the gofmt -w 23:03 <+iant> well, hg knows 23:03 -!- crakrjak [~merc@rrcs-70-62-156-154.central.biz.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:03 <+iant> running hg mail will send the change over to the codereview site 23:04 < ni|> iant: this system is amazing 23:04 < ni|> that was so easy 23:04 < ni|> i didn't even have to say PTAL 23:04 < ni|> it knew 23:04 < ni|> :) 23:12 -!- thaostra [~joshua@pool-96-252-6-184.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #go-nuts 23:15 -!- thaostra [~joshua@pool-96-252-6-184.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Client Quit] 23:17 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPnCd by [James Toy] in go/doc/ -- doc/htmlgen.go: remove unnecessary semicolons 23:20 -!- b00m_chef__ [~watr@d64-180-45-230.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:21 -!- Xera^ [~brit@87-194-208-246.bethere.co.uk] has joined #go-nuts 23:21 -!- iant [~iant@nat/google/x-wfvzdpcmaqdqbkgs] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:27 -!- The_Cog [~chatzilla@i-195-137-123-15.freedom2surf.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6/20100115133306]] 23:29 -!- TR2N [email@89.180.158.168] has joined #go-nuts 23:33 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPoBf by [Andrew Gerrand] in go/src/pkg/http/ -- http: add Error helper function 23:33 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPoBj by [Russ Cox] in go/src/pkg/os/ -- os: drop File finalizer after normal Close 23:33 < plexdev> http://is.gd/aPoBw by [Rob Pike] in go/src/ -- Make.cmd: make 'all' the default target (was 'clean': BUG) 23:35 -!- cmarcelo [~cmarcelo@enlightenment/developer/cmarcelo] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:38 -!- homiziado [~ernestofr@62.169.79.211.rev.optimus.pt] has joined #go-nuts 23:40 -!- tor5 [~tor@c-987a71d5.04-50-6c756e10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #go-nuts 23:46 -!- wrtp [~rog@89.241.218.64] has quit [Quit: wrtp] 23:47 -!- hstimer [~hstimer@2002:465a:aa25:0:226:bbff:fe05:dd9b] has quit [Quit: hstimer] 23:47 -!- iant [~iant@67.218.109.59] has joined #go-nuts 23:47 -!- mode/#go-nuts [+v iant] by ChanServ 23:49 -!- belkiss [~kvirc@12.132.45.103] has joined #go-nuts 23:54 -!- vomjom [~vomjom@99-157-248-71.lightspeed.stlsmo.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:54 -!- Xera^ [~brit@87-194-208-246.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.21 :: www.esnation.com )] 23:57 -!- vomjom [~vomjom@99-157-248-71.lightspeed.stlsmo.sbcglobal.net] has joined #go-nuts --- Log closed Sat Mar 20 00:00:29 2010