--- Log opened Mon Oct 11 00:00:10 2010
00:00 < exch> what do you mean by that?
00:02 < strtok> i have an object called Dispatcher that receives a message
over a channel.  It then sets a local string to point to a slice in that message.
00:02 < strtok> later on, the string is no longer set to the slice
00:03 < strtok> now, there would be no reference anymore to the original
string this slice points to
00:03 < strtok> but i figured if the slice still has reference, the string
should be valid
00:03 < exch> If the value in that slice changed at some point, the string
will to.  In essence it's just a pointer to the string data
00:04 < strtok> hrm
00:04 < exch> At least that is what I would guess.  I'd have to try it out
to be sure
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00:05 < exch> hmm or not
00:06 < strtok> but strings are immutable
00:06 < exch> yes
00:06 < exch> nope.  the string assignment copies the string to the new
00:07 < exch> so changing the slice should not matter
00:08 * exch is puzzled
00:09 < strtok> http://pastebin.com/gTKg5Gg0
00:09 < strtok> the dis.ircPass and dis.ircNick are the assignments
00:10 < strtok> they're fine until Dispatch returns and is called again,
then they're empty once again
00:10 < exch> oh..  you are calling DispatchIRC() on a Value of Dispatcher.
It should be a pointer
00:11 < strtok> i just noticed that
00:11 < exch> Field changes do not persist, because DispatchIRC() operates
on a copy
00:11 < strtok> yes
00:11 < strtok> ugh
00:11 < strtok> i have that everywhere!:D
00:11 < exch> hehe
00:11 < strtok> thanks
00:12 < skelterjohn> one of the more common go bugs
00:14 < strtok> yeah
00:14 < strtok> a lot of the syntax is new
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02:52 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fW3O3 by [Andrew Gerrand] in go/src/pkg/time/
-- time: add After
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03:44 < SirPsychoS> is there any interest in / use for libcurl bindings for
Go? or is there some equivalent functionality I'm overlooking in the standard
package library?
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04:16 < uriel> SirPsychoS: there is equivalent functionality in the http
04:16 < uriel> but there are libcurl bindings too, I think, check
04:17 < uriel> hmmmmm...  or maybe not there, I think I have seen it at some
04:17 < uriel> let me know if you find/make them, and I will add them there
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04:43 < SirPsychoS> heh, go-lang.cat-v.org was the second place I looked for
libcurl bindings (only after golang.org)
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06:17 < NachnaOndaNei> party time!
06:17 * NachnaOndaNei dances
06:18 < AtlasSoldier> You guys is boring, yo.
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06:23 < SirPsychoS> 01:20am < NachnaOndaNei> party time!  <- makes
me wonder whether #go-nuts is the best name for this channel, due to the possible
confusion of people who actually wish to go nuts
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06:24 < Bombe> :)
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09:28 < jnwhiteh> I am writing a library that a number of executables
(commands) will need, and I'm developing them side-by-side.  What sort of
build/make process would you guys use in a situation like that?
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09:40 < SirPsychoS> jnwhiteh: I'm facing this same issue at the moment, and
what I'm doing (not sure if it's an acceptable solution or not) is having the
Makefiles for the commands add dependencies on
09:40 < jnwhiteh> I'm trying to avoid building anything to GOROOT during
09:40 < jnwhiteh> since it seems to me that I shouldn't need to =/
09:40 < SirPsychoS> I haven't found any way to avoid that
09:40 < jnwhiteh> I have a makefile that supports this, I just dont like
doing things in an idiomatic way.
09:41 < SirPsychoS> I couldn't get the Make.cmd makefiles to properly link
my own packages unless they were in $GOROOT
09:41 < jnwhiteh> I'm not using Make.cmd for that reason
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09:42 < SirPsychoS> well that works, although I don't really see why
Make.cmd doesn't handle packages rooted in ./pkg, or wherever else
09:42 < jnwhiteh> if they're properly namespaced, I agree.
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09:42 < jnwhiteh> I'm sure there's a reason, I just dunno what it is.
09:42 < jnwhiteh> there was a topic recently on the mailing list, I'm just
not sure where that thread is now.
09:43 < SirPsychoS> as far as I can tell, though, you're expected to install
every package you use into $GOROOT
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09:44 < SirPsychoS> and I guess I can see the benefits of that, but I'm not
sure I like it - what if you've got packages that are really only useful for one
executable, for example
09:44 < jnwhiteh> I think the concern came from what happens when two
packages conflict
09:44 < jnwhiteh> i.e.  if you have a regexp package, which one gets
09:44 < jnwhiteh> err linked in
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09:45 < jnwhiteh> lemme see if I can find that thread, it may be on another
09:45 < wrtp> SirPsychoS: Make.cmd works fine for code outside $GOROOT
09:45 < wrtp> you have to include $GOROOT/src/Make.cmd
09:45 < wrtp> not ../../Make.cmd
09:45 < SirPsychoS> wrtp: yeah, I know it compiles things properly
09:46 < wrtp> sorry, i thought that was your problem
09:46 < jnwhiteh> wrtp: it does not work if you want to link against a
package that is local, not global.
09:46 < SirPsychoS> but it can't seem to link in packages that aren't
goinstall-ed or (make install)ed
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09:46 < wrtp> i see
09:46 < SirPsychoS> yes, what jnwhiteh said
09:46 < wrtp> you're right, packages are assumed to be installed under
09:47 < wrtp> but why not?  it's not much of a hardship
09:47 < jnwhiteh> and I would say that packages don't need to be installed,
they can be linked into the executable just fine
09:47 < jnwhiteh> it just bothers me in principle =)
09:47 < wrtp> which principle is that :-)
09:47 < jnwhiteh> and changes my development in a bad way
09:47 < wrtp> ?
09:47 < SirPsychoS> I agree, it's not much of a hardship, and I've got my
Makefile working such that I can deal with it
09:48 < jnwhiteh> I don't like having to make install one thing so I can
make another thing
09:48 < jnwhiteh> what if I have a stable version of the package installed
in my GOROOT
09:48 < jnwhiteh> and want to test changes to it without disrupting that
stable version
09:48 < jnwhiteh> I then have to change my target in my makefile in order to
do that
09:48 < jnwhiteh> that seems silly
09:48 < jnwhiteh> I should be able to write code and test in isolation until
the point where I want to install the files.
09:48 < wrtp> i think that seems quite sensible actually
09:49 < wrtp> you change the target to something temporary
09:49 < wrtp> i.e.  temporarily forking the original version of the package
09:49 < jnwhiteh> why should I have to change anything?
09:49 < jnwhiteh> why can't "make" and "make install" be distinct?
09:49 < jnwhiteh> or rather, why shouldn't.
09:50 < wrtp> you need some way of distinguishing between different versions
of a package
09:50 < SirPsychoS> or: if I want to make a command that has gotest-testable
components (aka components that aren't allowed to be in package main), so most of
the code is in a package that is literally only useful for that command, then I
have to goinstall or make install that package into $GOROOT, even though it really
doesn't belong there
09:50 < wrtp> they are distinct
09:50 < jnwhiteh> wrtp: when finished, yes..  during development its just a
09:50 < jnwhiteh> I can write my own makefile that does this, I just fail to
see why it can't be supported.
09:50 < jnwhiteh> its not difficult
09:51 < soul9> i like it, everything is confined in *one* directory
09:51 < jnwhiteh> sure, for _INSTALLED_ files
09:51 < jnwhiteh> but that's not what I am talking about here
09:51 < jnwhiteh> and my source is already in another directory
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09:51 < soul9> so just replace the libraries in your src/pkg
09:51 < jnwhiteh> I'm just asking that I be able to use files from the
directory I am already in
09:51 < wrtp> i don't see that changing one string at the top of the file
and one in the makefile is a great hardship
09:51 < jnwhiteh> its not
09:52 < jnwhiteh> but I fail to see any argument here for why what I'm
asking about can't be supported.
09:52 < soul9> you can, just do import "./pkg"
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09:52 < soul9> or even "./dir/pkg"
09:52 < SirPsychoS> won't that import $GOROOT/pkg/$GOOS_$GOARCH/./pkg?
09:52 < soul9> no, it won't
09:53 < SirPsychoS> I could've sworn I tried that...
09:53 < soul9> not hard enough ;)
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09:53 < wrtp> personally, i keep a pseudo domain for test forks of packages.
then it installs there, but doesn't affect anything else
09:55 < wrtp> one problem with using local versions of globally available
packages is that there can be a conflict if some other package has linked against
the original version (which has the same path).  using a unique path gets around
that problem
09:56 < jnwhiteh> Aye, I understand that difficulty.
09:56 < jnwhiteh> my work is a bit bizarre, the packages I work on are never
installed *shrug*
09:57 < wrtp> do you mean "i never install them" or "nobody else installs
09:57 < jnwhiteh> both
09:57 < soul9> so just include them in your source and import
"./lib/foo/_obj/pkg" or something
09:57 < jnwhiteh> soul9: I have my makefile set up so I don't have to do
that, but yes, that is an option.
09:57 < wrtp> just install them.  i really don't see the problem in having
some object files in a directory under $GOROOT
09:58 < soul9> there still is no make uninstall
09:58 < soul9> which sucks imho
09:58 < soul9> everything is pooped all over by stale object files
09:58 < jnwhiteh> wrtp: I don't need my development 'crap' going into my go
09:58 < SirPsychoS> soul9: heh, I wrote my own
09:58 < jnwhiteh> I need stuff in one place, so that is how I'm developing.
09:59 < SirPsychoS> wow, it does in fact work
09:59 < SirPsychoS> never tried "./pkgname/_obj/packagename"
10:00 * SirPsychoS slaps SirPsychoS
10:00 * soul9 slaps SirPsychoS
10:00 < wrtp> jnwhiteh: but go keeps things nicely separated.  so even if
your dev stuff is under $GOROOT, it's still not really mixed up with the core
10:01 < SirPsychoS> wrtp: when I goinstall something, it gets dumped
straight in $GOROOT/pkg/linuxwhatever/
10:01 < soul9> of course it's not, just in pkg/os_arch/
10:01 < SirPsychoS> which is where all the included packages are as well,
10:01 < wrtp> SirPsychoS: $GOROOT/pkg/os_arch/install_path_root/....
10:02 < jnwhiteh> you can disagree with the way I choose to do my
development, but I really don't think its an unreasonable thing to want to do
10:02 < wrtp> the point is that install_path_root is unique for your stuff
10:02 < soul9> jnwhiteh: we just showed you a way to do it.
10:02 < jnwhiteh> soul9: I know, I'm not talking to you =)
10:02 < SirPsychoS> jnwhiteh: the new solution in light of the 'import
"./pkg/_obj/pkg"' method can be implemented fairly easily
10:02 < jnwhiteh> yes, again guys
10:03 < jnwhiteh> I already HAD a solution
10:03 < soul9> so you want *two* ways of doing it
10:03 < jnwhiteh> its worked perfectly for quite some time
10:03 < soul9> ah, then three
10:03 < jnwhiteh> soul9: no
10:03 < jnwhiteh> I was asking.
10:03 < jnwhiteh> a simple question
10:03 < soul9> sorry
10:03 < jnwhiteh> that doesn't indicate a demand or desire
10:03 * soul9 reads the backlog and slaps himself
10:03 < wrtp> you could do ln -s $HOME/path/to/my/tmp/obj/direct
10:03 < soul9> 11:54 jnwhiteh: I'm just asking that I be able to use files
from the directory I am already in
10:04 < SirPsychoS> jnwhiteh: what you're wishing for is a way to both use
local packages and use Make.cmd, right?
10:04 < jnwhiteh> soul9: yes, and I already have solutions for that.
10:04 < soul9> ah
10:04 < jnwhiteh> my original question was how people handled this sort of
10:04 < jnwhiteh> I personally dont' like having to install everything to
GOROOT for every single compilation
10:04 < SirPsychoS> ah, well I'm about to redefine how I handle it, lol
10:04 < jnwhiteh> but that's just me
10:04 < jnwhiteh> and there are alternatives
10:04 < jnwhiteh> so that works out.
10:04 < soul9> i just do import normalpkgname "/path/to/pkg/obj"
10:05 < wrtp> you don't like it because...  why?
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10:05 < jnwhiteh> because I don't.
10:05 < wrtp> ok, good reason
10:05 < jnwhiteh> Last time I checked this wasn't a hostile confrontation
10:05 < jnwhiteh> I don't see why I need to justify my personal development
decisions to you?
10:06 < jnwhiteh> I'm not sure why you're being so confrontational about the
whole topic, honestly.
10:07 < SirPsychoS> jnwhiteh: the (new) what I handle it is to make a
standard Make.cmd makefile, and prepend to it 'targetname:
-C includedpackage'
10:07 < SirPsychoS> err, that's entirely unreadable...  sorry
10:07 < jnwhiteh> lol
10:08 < SirPsychoS> anyway, just add a dependency on the .a file you need,
then define that target to call make recursively on the package directory
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10:14 < SirPsychoS> although it would be much easier if we could just have a
way to coerce Make.cmd to pass a -I flag to 6g
10:15 < SirPsychoS> and -L to 6l
10:15 < jnwhiteh> I'd even take a rigid directory structure and
DEPLOCAL_PKGS or something like that, but I'll just keep happily doing what I'm
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12:07 < wrtp> jnwhiteh: sorry, i didn't want to sound hostile
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12:08 < wrtp> it's just that there are many design decisions in go that are
made for good reason, and it's not that helpful if the only reason for arguing
against them is just "because."
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14:17 < jnwhiteh> wrtp: Well I understand that, but I had already given a
number of reasons why.  You were asking why I choose to do development that way,
and me answering _THAT_ question isn't productive to the discussion at all.
14:17 < jnwhiteh> The fact of the matter is I prefer to keep all of my
projects in their own little world, with a stock Go world on the outside that
helps me run my little world.  I do precisely the same thing when working with
dynamic scripting languages, and as often as possible even with C-like projects.
14:18 < jnwhiteh> Either way, no hard feelings and thank you for the
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14:42 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXbzt by [Adam Langley] in
go/src/pkg/crypto/tls/ -- crypto/tls: better error messages for certificate
14:42 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXbzJ by [Adam Langley] in
go/src/pkg/crypto/tls/ -- crypto/tls: make SetReadTimeout work.
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15:36 < nickaugust> 8l is returning this error:
15:36 < nickaugust> augo.Index: undefined: runtime.catstring
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15:47 < nickaugust> hmmmmmmm...  wtf
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16:53 < wrtp> nickaugust: rebuild from scratch, and make sure you haven't
left any old object files around.
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17:15 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXnUL by [Russ Cox] in go/ -- CONTRIBUTORS:
link sam.thorogood@gmail.com for code review
17:15 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXnUQ by [Sam Thorogood] in go/src/pkg/expvar/
-- expvar: add (*Int).Set
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18:32 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXtDI by [Russ Cox] in go/ -- A+C: Jim McGrath
(individual CLA)
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18:49 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXuRY by [Jim McGrath] in go/src/cmd/ld/ --
6l: fix Mach-O LC_RPATH
18:49 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXuSa by [Jim McGrath] in go/src/cmd/ld/ --
6l: correct offset for __nl_symbol_ptr in Mach-O.
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19:05 < Xenith> Does Go have a dynamic loading mechanism for
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19:05 < nsf> Xenith: currently no
19:06 < Xenith> Ah. Planned feature down the road sometime maybe?
19:07 < skelterjohn> definitely
19:07 < skelterjohn> critical thing to have, in general.  go is in the early
stages, though.
19:08 < anticw> is it critical?
19:08 < anticw> plan9 doesn't have it
19:08 < skelterjohn> both of those statements are just in my opinion, of
19:08 < anticw> certainly you could fudge something now w/ gccgo and a
little effort i think
19:09 < Xenith> I dunno about critical, but more useful than not, certainly.
19:10 < anticw> iant: has anyone tried dlopen w/ gccgo?
19:11 < nsf> gccgo actually supports shared objects, as far as I know
19:11 < Xenith> How's gccgo coming along?  I haven't tried it yet since its
not in any gcc release, and I'm too lazy to compile gcc at the moment.
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19:12 < napsy> Xenith: it's scheduled to be released together with gcc 4.6
19:12 < anticw> nsf: it's working very well here
19:13 < anticw> i update 2-3 times a week and usually don't see any
problems, the biggest issue for me now is the ...  changes in 6g
19:13 < nsf> last time I tried gccgo
19:13 < nsf> its std library was out-dated
19:14 < anticw> it's updated from time to time, it's not too bad now
19:14 < nsf> and apparently supporting two compilers for a Go project isn't
fun, because Go changes rapidly
19:14 < nsf> maybe later in future it will be ok
19:14 < nsf> when std lib will be more solid
19:14 < nsf> as well as the language itself
19:14 < anticw> it's really not that bad, iant updates it enough to keep it
quite usable
19:15 < anticw> certainly xml, http, gzip, json, net, etc all work well
enough i can use either compiler just fine
19:15 < nsf> well, that's just my experience trying it out
19:15 < nsf> I wasn't able to compile gocode with gccgo
19:15 < anticw> oh god, i just publically admitted to using xml ...  ill me
19:15 < anticw> kill
19:17 < nsf> don't worry a lot of people use xml
19:18 < anticw> a lot of flies eat shit, that's hardly an endorsement
19:18 < nsf> http://code.google.com/p/obkey/ <- I've acutally ended up
writing a program that serves as a GUI to an XML-based config format
19:18 < nsf> well, XML is not that bad
19:19 < nsf> XML haters are overreacting
19:20 < nsf> but if you use xslt
19:20 < nsf> :D
19:20 < anticw> nsf: what did you do the screencast with?
19:21 < nsf> pyvnc2swf
19:21 < anticw> ok ...  i've used that as well
19:21 < anticw> so you just have a shared vnc to localhost ?
19:21 < nsf> I guess
19:21 < nsf> I've found some kind of a script that does all for me
19:22 < nsf> starts vnc server, does the job and shuts it down
19:22 < anticw> anyhow ...  neat, i wanted some sort of gui thang
19:22 < anticw> ill look more at that
19:22 < anticw> ideally i wanted something like Qt so it could be
19:22 < nsf> uhm..  Qt is a good idea for a cross-platform GUI
19:23 < nsf> but it's written in C++ and compilation times kill me
19:23 < exch> oo openbox user
19:23 < exch> <3
19:24 < nsf> I am, yes
19:24 < anticw> there are non-c++ bindings to Qt ...  i hoped that would
19:24 < anticw> things like wxWindows never seem to get far, i should check
19:25 < nsf> wxWindows is nice, but it has some issues if you want a true
cross-platform gui
19:25 < nsf> it uses native look for all platforms
19:25 < nsf> sounds good
19:25 < nsf> but in practice it means that you will have to tweak your app
for each platform
19:25 < anticw> native look is really what i would prefer, some tweak is OK
19:25 < anticw> but there are no bindings for it yet
19:25 < nsf> then use wxwidgets, it is quite decent
19:26 < nsf> and yeah, if you want to do your GUI in Go
19:26 < nsf> it's a bad idea for now
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19:26 < anticw> gtk+ has bindings, but it's a bit weird for non-gnome users
esp win32 & mac
19:26 < nsf> bindings will be an issue
19:27 < nsf> we have go-gtk yes
19:27 < nsf> but it still in a stage where API changes
19:27 < nsf> so..
19:27 < nsf> there will be some pain with that too
19:27 < anticw> sure, but something is better than nothing
19:27 < anticw> clearly it works well enough for ou
19:27 < anticw> you
19:27 < nsf> obkey is not written in Go
19:27 -!- aho [~nya@fuld-4d00d161.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #go-nuts
19:27 < nsf> it's python
19:28 < nsf> we were talking about XML, not about Go :)
19:36 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXxV8 by [Roger Peppe] in go/src/pkg/netchan/
-- netchan: zero out request to ensure correct gob decoding.
19:37 -!- wrtp [~rog@] has quit [Quit: wrtp]
19:40 <+iant> I don't know if anybody has tried dlopen with Go; I wrote the
libraries so that it should work, but like so much else I've never gotten around
to testing it
19:41 < KirkMcDonald> Callbacks are still an issue.
19:42 <+iant> Sorry, I meant with gccgo; I agree that dlopen doesn't work
with 6g/8g today
19:43 < KirkMcDonald> Ah.
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19:53 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXz2T by [Rob Pike] in 3 subdirs of go/src/ --
new command gotry.
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20:10 < unRuhe> hey can someone have a look at this
20:10 < unRuhe> I don't quite get why I cant use my version without pointers
20:11 < unRuhe> i want x and y to be unexported
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20:11 < KirkMcDonald> unRuhe: Is this all in the same package?
20:12 < unRuhe> the calls are in another package
20:13 < unRuhe> i new to the language and i'm playing with visibility
20:13 < KirkMcDonald> When you call NewPoint, it returns a "point" by value.
20:13 < KirkMcDonald> When you assign that value to a variable, it is
implicitly assigning the (unexported) fields.
20:14 < KirkMcDonald> To put it another way, it makes no sense to deal with
a struct by value when that struct contains unexported fields.
20:14 < unRuhe> ahh then i misread the compiler output.  because i thought
he dislikes that x and y gets assigned
20:14 < KirkMcDonald> They are getting assigned, in that the entire struct
value is getting assigned.
20:15 < KirkMcDonald> unRuhe: The last function is acceptable, since it is
in the same package as the struct.
20:15 < unRuhe> so when i write p1 := NewPoint(1,2) in my main i will have
p1 wich is something i'm not allowed to see
20:16 < unRuhe> i think i got it, you helped me
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20:18 < unRuhe> i just got kinda pissed because the second thing i was
implementing was a line.  and then i had to pass *points insteads of points to the
initialisation method
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20:21 < unRuhe> anyway thx for the helb KirkMcDonald
20:22 < skelterjohn> x and y should probably be X and Y
20:22 < skelterjohn> something like a point doesn't really need hidden
20:22 < hoisie> it's kind of a pedantic issue..  I'd always return a pointer
in NewPoint
20:23 < unRuhe> i was just fiddeling
20:23 < skelterjohn> sure, but it's a pretty small structure
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20:23 < skelterjohn> i'd use "p := Point{x,y}" rather than a newing function
20:24 < unRuhe> yeah i was just trying to not confuse u with big codeblocks
20:24 < unRuhe> its was just for the sake of testing
20:24 < unRuhe> but i got it by kirks statment
20:24 < unRuhe> To put it another way, it makes no sense to deal with a
struct by value when that struct contains unexported fields.
20:24 < unRuhe> that seemed pretty obvious afterwards
20:25 < skelterjohn> it's not obvious to me that it has to be that way.  it
is clear that this is the way it is, though.
20:25 < plexdev> http://is.gd/fXBgd by [Russ Cox] in go/src/cmd/ld/ -- ld:
be less picky about bad line number info
20:26 < unRuhe> what i figured is, if i want to go the objecoriented way
where i only alter fieldvalues by calling methods.  i will only need pointers
instead of the types by value
20:27 < skelterjohn> that's certainly true, but i think that you should not
feel constrained by some canonical "OO style"
20:27 < skelterjohn> opinions vary
20:28 < unRuhe> yeah ure sure but i will give a talk at my uni and these
guys know only java
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20:28 < unRuhe> i currently figuiring out how go's objectorientaition works
for java minds
20:29 < skelterjohn> it's not really object oriented
20:29 < skelterjohn> more "interface-oriented", i guess
20:29 < unRuhe> yeah, but i think i can do most of the stuff i want from an
objectoriented languege
20:29 < skelterjohn> no concept of, for instance, polymorphism
20:30 < unRuhe> to put it that way
20:30 < skelterjohn> you can kind of fake inheritence
20:30 < skelterjohn> it's better to start from new ideas than to try to
shoe-horn it into old
20:30 < unRuhe> with anonymous fields i read that too
20:30 < skelterjohn> might be enlightening for your students :)
20:30 < unRuhe> i'm a student too
20:30 < unRuhe> :D
20:31 < unRuhe> but I get your point
20:31 < skelterjohn> you can be a student with students :)
20:32 < unRuhe> ok ty for ur opinons..  appreciate
20:32 < unRuhe> hf and byebye
20:32 < skelterjohn> later
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21:13 < skelterjohn> when catching something from recover(), is there a way
to see where the panic came from?
21:13 <+iant> you can call runtime.Caller
21:15 < skelterjohn> the stack below the recover isn't unwound?
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21:16 < cbeck> Someone (nsf?) gave me a tidy func to print a stacktrace on
error, it's in github.com/ckolbeck/go-irc
21:17 <+iant> skelterjohn: right, defer functions are called without
unwinding the stack, the stack is only unwound afterward
21:17 < skelterjohn> neat, thanks
21:17 <+iant> that way you get a good stack trace when a panic occurs
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21:17 < skelterjohn> makes sense
21:17 < skelterjohn> was worried that the info might be stuffed into a
structure you got out of recover()'s return, or something
21:17 < skelterjohn> but that would be ridiculous
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21:42 < matti_> does a goroutine automatically join the main thread after
its finished its program execution?
21:43 < skelterjohn> i'm not sure that question makes sense
21:43 < exch> not if the main thread exits first.  You have to wait for it
to finish
21:43 < skelterjohn> once a goroutine is finished, how could it join
21:44 < skelterjohn> maybe exch understood the question behind the question
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21:44 < skelterjohn> or i'm dumb.  both are possible.
21:44 < exch> :p
21:44 <+iant> it refers to pthread_join, but goroutines are not threads
21:44 < matti_> i guess im thinking of goroutine as sort of like a thread
21:44 <+iant> and goroutines don't have return values
21:44 < bartbes> but it wouldn't make sense for a thread to join the main
thread either, would it?
21:45 < bartbes> it should just..  die
21:45 <+iant> there is no way to wait for a goroutine to exit; you can only
wait for a goroutine to send a value on a channel
21:45 < matti_> iant: do you know of any good resources for reading up on
the mechanics of goroutines?
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21:46 < matti_> how a programmer should use it, best practices, etc.
21:46 <+iant> I can't think of any, just the source code and the mailing
21:46 < matti_> i see...  ok
21:46 < skelterjohn> i wonder if the fact that "go foo()" doesn't evaluate
to anything will ever change
21:46 < skelterjohn> like, a channel that will send what foo() returns or
21:47 < skelterjohn> though i think it's been suggested and shot down a few
times so far
21:48 < skelterjohn> and it could be compiled away to nothing when the go
statement isn't assigned to anything
21:48 -!- ShadowIce [~pyoro@unaffiliated/shadowice-x841044] has quit [Quit:
21:48 <+iant> you can do it yourself using a wrapper and recover; I don't
think there is a clear implementation that would work generally
21:49 < skelterjohn> don't need recover...not talking about panics
21:50 < matti_> what does a goroutine do after its program of execution is
21:50 < skelterjohn> evaporates?
21:50 < matti_> does it just kill itself automatically?
21:51 < matti_> i went through the language specification at golang.org but
it was ambiguous
21:51 < skelterjohn> w/r/t go foo() returning a chan, this is the behavior i
meant: http://pastebin.com/SYw4EQZs
21:51 < matti_> just said that to "fork" a goroutine to use the go semantics
21:52 < skelterjohn> except it would have to have the right parameters and
return value
21:53 < skelterjohn> matti_: if a goroutine has nothing left to do, what
else can it do but disappear?
21:53 < KirkMcDonald> matti_:
21:53 < KirkMcDonald> matti_: "When main.main() returns, the program exits.
It does not wait for other (non-main) goroutines to complete."
21:53 < skelterjohn> oh, i misunderstood
21:53 < skelterjohn> you mean the program in which it is running exits?
21:53 < skelterjohn> then yeah, what KirkMcDonald said
21:53 < matti_> nah, i was referring to the goroutines themselves
21:54 < skelterjohn> then i'm still misunderstanding
21:54 < skelterjohn> how can a goroutine "do something" once it is finished?
21:54 < matti_> but from KirkMcDonald's line, i would imagine that implies
that the goroutines themselves exit as well?
21:55 < matti_> as i understand it, goroutines are another "thread" of
21:55 < skelterjohn> when main.main returns, all goroutines halt and
evaporate it
21:55 < skelterjohn> and they aren't threads
21:55 < matti_> they aren't really threads though
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21:55 < matti_> they have their own stack management
21:56 < matti_> and a programmer forks these goroutines to get better
21:56 < skelterjohn> or any, really
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21:56 < skelterjohn> since "go" is the only parallelization construct in the
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23:04 < anticw> iant: do the gc changes that crop up from time to time make
life hard for you?
23:04 <+iant> not really
23:04 <+iant> I just have to do regular merges
23:04 < anticw> iant: looking over your commits makes everything look easy
23:04 < ajstarks> nope.  so far they've been eary
23:04 < ajstarks> -- I mean easy
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23:05 < anticw> iant: so doing the []T{ T{...} } -> {}T{ {...} } isn't
going to be problematic?
23:06 <+iant> it should be straightforward
23:06 <+iant> I hope
23:07 <+iant> the really painful change was when we dropped any requirement
for declaring a function or variable before its use in the same package; that
happened before the public release, though
23:07 <+iant> I had to rewrite a lot of stuff to make that work
23:07 < anticw> yeah, i see mixed style there
23:08 < anticw> moslty i tend to declare before use as a C habit, i'm not
that's always friendly though
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23:08 < anticw> iant: post gcc-4.6 are you doing to drop your repo and just
use mainline gcc's ?
23:08 <+iant> I'm not going to drop the gofrontend-dev repository, if that
is what you are asking
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23:09 <+iant> my agreement with the gcc steering committee is that that is
the master source for the non-gcc-specific parts of the Go frontend, and that the
version in gcc is a copy
23:11 < enferex> hello iant
23:11 <+iant> howdy
23:11 < enferex> I just want to personally thank you for all your replies to
my threads on the mailing list
23:11 <+iant> you're welcome
23:12 < enferex> its for my PhD thesis work
23:12 < enferex> just starting now to want to target go as my language I
implement my ideas in
23:12 < cthom> enferex: do u go.to odu?
23:13 < enferex> now im scared
23:14 < enferex> I graduated with my masters from there in 2007
23:14 < cthom> haha.  recognized the handle from hrgeeks
23:14 < cthom> small world
23:14 < enferex> im in Melbourne Australia, decided to take a leave of
absence from my employer of 5.5 years to go back to school
23:15 < enferex> cthom: wow well greets from Oz
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23:56 < ajstarks> any interest in graphics programming?
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--- Log closed Tue Oct 12 00:00:10 2010