--- Log opened Wed Apr 13 00:00:43 2011
--- Day changed Wed Apr 13 2011
00:00 < foolusion> is using channels the go way to do this?  or should I
have brute forced the array or slice like C/C++
00:01 < krutcha> since you're only doing one calculation in a goroutine then
waiting for it to finish..  there's really no reason making it look concurrent
00:02 < krutcha> might as well just make your multiples function tally up
result as it goes, then return it
00:03 < krutcha> if you wanted you could split the range up into ranges,
then fire each range to an instance of multiples working on that chunk, to
parallelize the % checks
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00:05 < foolusion> yeah, i read something about gc not optimizing
parallelism yet is that still true or has it been added in already?
00:06 < foolusion> like 4 routines on 1 core instead of 4
00:06 < plexdev> http://is.gd/KOJoi3 by [Fazlul Shahriar] in go/src/pkg/os/
-- os: fix Readdir in Plan 9
00:06 < krutcha> beats me, not sure what the various compilers do with
threads, hyperthreading, multi cores exactly
00:07 < krutcha> you should experiment with setting this:
00:08 < krutcha> as well (I think it defaults to 1?)
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00:11 < foolusion> is printing more efficient in go than c it seems like i
can print to the console without significant speed loss
00:12 < krutcha> shouldn't be no
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00:13 < foolusion> maybe my console flush is different on this computer..
00:13 < skelterjohn> i'd imagine that fmt.Printf is a bit slower than C's
00:15 < foolusion> thats what i would have thought but I edited sieve1.go to
add a bunch of print calls and it doesnt seem to hamper performance the same way
it would when i output in C/C++
00:15 < skelterjohn> if you are invoking C code from go, there is a
performance hit there
00:16 < skelterjohn> sorry, didn't read carefully
00:16 < skelterjohn> it's possible that go's concurrency mechanism is giving
some advantages
00:18 < exch> mm fallthrough doesnt seem to be valid inside anything but a
case statement
00:18 < exch> bit odd, since break and continue are
00:19 < foolusion> can you break to labels like in C++
00:19 < exch> yes
00:20 < foolusion> is that the best way of getting out of nested loops?
00:20 < skelterjohn> yes
00:20 < exch> probably
00:20 < foolusion> I don't know why but I always feel wrong using labels
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00:27 < foolusion> when you use ch := make(chan int) it returns a value but
is ch a reference or some datastructure or something?
00:30 < foolusion> printing ch looks like it gives an address
00:30 < krutcha> it's a channel, considered a first class value type in the
00:32 < foolusion> but when i pass it as a argument in a function i
shouldn't use (ch *chan int) because its already an address
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00:33 < krutcha> right you can think of it as a reference to a channel in
that sense, ie passing by value won't create a new channel
00:33 < foolusion> so if i made a buffered channel it won't copy itself
00:34 < krutcha> nope, they're intended to be passed around like that
00:34 < krutcha> and shared as sync mechanisms between goroutines etc
00:35 < krutcha> the buffered/unbuffered thing just affects the amount of
data that fits in the channel, and whether it is blocking or not
00:35 < krutcha> with an unbuffered channel, your write to a channel blocks
until a reader consumes it, so parallel goes out the window, but sync is ensured
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00:36 < foolusion> can you resize them?
00:37 < krutcha> hmm dunno, don't think so, I think the initial make() sets
the fifo size and thats it
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00:38 < foolusion> what about clearing a channel?  should i just make a new
00:38 < plexdev> http://is.gd/SjWXfi by [Gustavo Niemeyer] in
go/misc/dashboard/godashboard/ -- godashboard: Show packages at launchpad.net
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00:39 < krutcha> I _think_ the only way to remove data from a channel is
consume it by reading, or close the channel
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00:41 < foolusion> hmm, so I'm not sure how this would work but, lets say
you were doing some sort of LOD algorithm ona time constraint and you have excess
data in a channel should you just close it and hope its gc'ed or is there a read
til empty?
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00:42 < foolusion> excess data would be totally useless next frame so you
don't want it
00:43 < krutcha> I think you can call len() on a channel to see how many
data items are in it
00:44 < krutcha> or you could use select{} to either receive more data, or
if none is available break out of a loop?
00:44 < krutcha> some of these go idioms I haven't really grokked fully yet,
so grain of salt
00:46 < krutcha> look here:
00:46 < foolusion> is it ch.len() or len(ch).  the latter returns 0 always
for me
00:47 < krutcha> if you look at the select control structure, the 'default'
case could be used to detect an empty channel
00:47 < krutcha> but I thought len(ch) worked as well
00:48 < krutcha> try commenting out your reader
00:48 < foolusion> the reader is in a range statement
00:48 < foolusion> i might have to write a different test
00:49 < krutcha> len(s) chan T number of elements queued in channel buffer
00:49 < krutcha> so len should work
00:49 < foolusion> my reader is probably not letting them queue at all
00:51 < foolusion> hmm still getting 0's
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00:54 < krutcha> http://pastebin.com/AmYqFBJW
00:54 < krutcha> that printed 100 for me
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01:02 < foolusion> i'm probably doing something wrong i just added it into
the for loop with my sender so I would expect at least a 1 when it puts it on the
channel but i guess its blocking until the reciever pulls it off before printing
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01:10 < plexdev> http://is.gd/H5DWlF by [David Symonds] in
go/src/pkg/archive/tar/ -- archive/tar: fix example's handling of os.EOF.
01:10 < foolusion> when is a value considered received when its pulled off
of the channel or when its copied to the channel?
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01:11 < skelterjohn> who are you asking?
01:12 < skelterjohn> i mean, that's not a programming question - just a
question of opinion
01:12 < skelterjohn> do you have a more specific question about what happens
in some case?
01:12 < foolusion> well i think i can't call len on an unbuffered chan
because its blocking until the reciever pulls it off
01:13 < skelterjohn> there is no way to test if someone is trying to send to
an unbuffered chan without receiving the value
01:14 < skelterjohn> if you want that knowledge, you'll have to build
additional infrastructure
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01:15 < foolusion> so unbuffered actually means no data is stored not an
unknown amount?
01:15 < foolusion> i mean arbitrary
01:16 < skelterjohn> yes
01:16 < skelterjohn> that's right
01:16 < skelterjohn> "there is no buffer"
01:17 < foolusion> i thought it was acting like a vector or something
01:18 < skelterjohn> vectors are buffered
01:20 < foolusion> yeah i thought it was just hiding it like calling vector
without an initial size
01:23 < skelterjohn> ah.  nope.
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01:30 < foolusion> any good reading recommendations for parallel
programming(book or online).  I took an OS class a couple years ago but we just
went over locks, mutex, and semaphore.
01:31 < skelterjohn> dunno
01:31 < skelterjohn> i'm not much on books
01:31 < skelterjohn> except as entertainment
01:32 < skelterjohn> the collective concurrency knowledge of the people in
this channel is probably great enough to answer most questions
01:32 < vsmatck> skelterjohn: Short story for you (if you haven't already
read).  http://www-formal.stanford.edu/jmc/robotandbaby/robotandbaby.html I read
it yesterday and it was enjoyable.
01:33 < foolusion> i'm a textbook collector
01:35 < skelterjohn> thanks vsmatck
01:35 < skelterjohn> foolusion: me too, i just don't read them first
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01:51 < foolusion> anyone have experience setting up vim to allow ":make
filename" for go
01:53 < dfc> this is really embarising
01:53 < dfc> but how do I tell vim to use the misc/vim stuff ?
01:54 < dfc> what is the incantatino in .vimrc I need ?
01:54 < foolusion> do you have the files in .vim/ftplugin and .vim/ftdetect?
01:54 < foolusion> or links to them
01:55 < dfc> no, but I can set that up
01:55 < skelterjohn> <insert inflammatory comment about vim here>
01:56 * dfc ignores skelterjohns comment
01:57 < plexdev> http://is.gd/4j2Kgm by [Dmitry Chestnykh] in
go/misc/vim/ftplugin/go/ -- misc/vim: add plugin with Fmt command.
01:57 < foolusion> yay dmitry
01:58 < foolusion> dfc: did linking those files make it work?
01:59 < dfc> no
01:59 < dfc> lucky(~/devel/afp) % find ~/.vim -type l
01:59 < dfc> \
01:59 < dfc> /Users/dave/.vim/ftdetect/gofiletype.vim
01:59 < dfc> /Users/dave/.vim/ftplugin/go
01:59 < dfc> are symlinks to the right business
01:59 < dfc> do I neet anything in a .vimrc to tell it to look there ?
02:01 < foolusion> try adding "filetype on" "filetype plugin on"
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02:01 < dfc> nup
02:01 < dfc> probably the weaksauce vim that comes with os x
02:02 < foolusion> hmmnot sure if its windows but you might need to store it
in _vimfile
02:02 < foolusion> oops _vimfiles/
02:05 < foolusion> it looks like .vim/ is the right place on mac
02:07 < foolusion> I'd try just copying the files.  and use smartindent
instead of auto if thats the problem
02:09 < dfc> k
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05:00 < plexdev> http://is.gd/wU9cy1 by [Andrew Gerrand] in
go/misc/dashboard/builder/ -- builder: fix documentation
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05:31 < krutcha1> why does http.Get return a reader interface that you must
read and close as a body, instead of just the body itself?
05:32 < dfc> krutcha1: what if the body never ended ?
05:32 < krutcha1> hasn't it already been read when you called Get()?
05:32 < dfc> nope
05:32 < dfc> the reader will take over once the header processing has
05:32 < krutcha1> ooohhhh
05:33 < krutcha1> I'm glad we had this little chat
05:33 < krutcha1> :P
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05:41 < wchicken> I have an instance where setting GOMAXPROCS to 3 gives
much higher performance than 4 (I have a 4-core system)
05:41 < wchicken> what's the best way to investigate what bottlenecks are in
my code to cause this?
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07:06 < krutcha1> hmm in go, if I have a slice of bytes, how do I take 2
bytes and convert them to a large int?
07:08 < krutcha1> fmt.Printf("%d", slice[0]) seems to have no problem with a
single byte, but what about taking 2 bytes as a uint16 from that slice of uint8's?
07:10 < cbeck> What are you trying to do with it?
07:11 < krutcha1> parse a binary encoded series of port numbers from an http
07:14 < cbeck> Easiest would probably be to just use unsafe to convert the
[]byte to an []int16.  Needs a bit of twiddling for the len and cap stuff
07:14 < edsrzf> The safer way would be to use the package encoding/binary
07:14 < cbeck> Derp, right
07:15 < krutcha1> oh, hmm didn't know that existed
07:15 < cbeck> Forget I said anything
07:15 < edsrzf> Or just do something like uint16(b[1]) | uint16(b[0])
<< 8
07:15 < krutcha1> does go support shift operators?
07:15 < edsrzf> Yes
07:16 < krutcha1> noice
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07:17 < Namegduf> Using encoding/binary automagically handles endianness.
07:17 < Namegduf> By having you specify it.
07:18 < krutcha1> it looks tricky to use?
07:18 < krutcha1> func Read(r io.Reader, order ByteOrder, data interface{})
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07:19 < edsrzf> It can be a little clunky, yeah.
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07:19 < edsrzf> When you already have a byte slice, I think it's easier to
use the ByteOrder variable's Uint16 method directly.
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07:21 < krutcha1> I have a hard time grokking go interfaces most days..
when I look at the byteorder variable it looks to be 'something that implements
the byteorder interface'
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07:22 < edsrzf> Yeah, it's implemented by BigEndian and LittleEndian, which
are variables in the package.
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07:25 < krutcha1> hmm that makes sense once you piece it together
07:26 < krutcha1> but parsing the docs on golang to get from ???  to
binary.BigEndian.Uint16([]byte(val.raw[i*6+4:]))) seems to require foreknowledge
that isn't IN the docs
07:27 < edsrzf> Yeah, it's tough because the types of BigEndian and
LittleEndian aren't exported, so they're not documented.
07:27 < edsrzf> They used to be exported, but that changed somewhere along
the line.
07:28 < krutcha1> a few simple examples of useage to connect the dots would
go a long way
07:28 < edsrzf> Probably godoc should be a little smarter and document
unexported types when variables of that type are exported.
07:28 < edsrzf> Yeah, examples would also be good.
07:29 < krutcha1> seems to have worked though, I see sane port numbers
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07:58 < autotron> could go's concurrency a similar approch to erlang's (many
lightweight processes)?
07:59 < autotron> could it be compaired ?
07:59 < autotron> compared
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08:01 < krutcha1> I'd say it's very comparable
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08:43 < mpl> if I have an os.Pipe, and I use it to link os.Stdin and
os.Stdout of two os.StartProcess, is there anything more I should do?  I'm
basically trying to do a find | grep and I'm getting an odd behaviour.  it seems
to be working only if the output of find is large enough.
08:44 < mpl> and yet, I think the Pipe is synchronous, so I thought the find
would wait for the grep process to finish reading before ending, no?
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08:58 < nsf>
08:58 < nsf> one Java wasn't enough
08:58 < nsf> how about "variable Natural count := 0;"
08:58 < nsf> lol
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09:57 < ww> anyone know where the proposed changes to get goinstall to do
commands are at?
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10:10 < Kunkka> Hi do anyone know how to listen for a bufio.read and at the
same time listen to a channel, in the same function?
10:17 < Namegduf> You can't.
10:17 < Namegduf> Spawn a new goroutine doing the read, have it communicate
with the first using a channel.
10:17 < Namegduf> Select on the two channels.
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10:21 < Kunkka> Yeah we guessd so, dont want to send our data over a channel
though, beacuse of the overhead.
10:21 < Kunkka> thanks anyway.
10:21 < Namegduf> Kunkka: Send a pointer.
10:21 < Namegduf> That said, sending a slice over a channel does *not* copy
10:21 < Namegduf> Slices are reference types, and behave like pointers to an
array holding the data which know the length and capacity of the data and array.
10:22 < Namegduf> (In fact, that's what they are)
10:22 < Namegduf> So sending the result of a read won't normally copy that
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10:25 < skelterjohn> ww: buried in adg's unsubmitted updates to gomake, i
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10:26 < ww> skelterjohn: :( well i hope it gets sorted relatively soon
10:26 < skelterjohn> he said a couple of weeks, in the golang-dev thread
10:26 < wrtp> Kunkka: as Namegduf says, there's little inherent overhead in
using a channel to send data.
10:26 < ww> i really want an install process that says, "run this command"
and results in a program in bin
10:27 < skelterjohn> http://go-gb.googlecode.com
10:27 < wrtp> Kunkka: the net package uses channels extensively, for example
10:27 < wrtp> mpl: have you got some example code?
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10:28 < skelterjohn> ww: oh - you want it do download stuff and build a cmd
10:29 < skelterjohn> my mistake - gb won't do that (except via goinstall for
10:29 < ww> right.  gb looks nice though...
10:30 < ww> yes, i just want to do "goinstall bitbucket.org/ww/foo" and end
up with foo in ${GOBIN}
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10:30 < Kunkka> Namegduf: wrtp Thanks for the help!
10:30 < Namegduf> No problem.
10:30 < skelterjohn> i don't know why goinstall didn't work for cmds from
the beginning
10:31 < skelterjohn> i guess because you need to analyze source to see which
makefile to include?
10:31 < ww> i think it's simple - is package main?  then cmd, else pkg
10:32 < ww> i guess people could make a library called main, but that would
be silly, wouldn't it?
10:33 < skelterjohn> that's how gb decides
10:34 < skelterjohn> only recently (a few months ago) was main allowed as
the name of a package
10:34 < skelterjohn> can use that to test cmds
10:34 < skelterjohn> gb will test cmds :)
10:34 < skelterjohn> but so will the new gotest, i believe
10:35 < wrtp> ww: some packages have main as well as a package
10:35 < ww> then there's the question of how to install gb - i'm thinking of
third party deployments by people who don't know go, may or may not know how to
use mercurial, or build things, but i use cgo to talk to some shared libraries...
10:36 < skelterjohn> gb will generate makefiles if you don't want your
project to have it as a dependence
10:36 < ww> so the process, "install necessary shared libraries uising your
os package manager", "install go from website", "run goinstall", done.
10:36 < skelterjohn> it's all moot - gomake is replacing it
10:36 < ww> that's about as complicated as it could stand to be
10:37 < skelterjohn> i no longer develop gb (though I still use it myself,
and if someone complains about a bug i'll fix it)
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10:39 < ww> well...  i anxiously await the new gomake
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11:17 < boomtopper> Hi I'm just playing around with compiling go.  I've run
the ./all.bash script and it doesn't look to have done any errors I think.  I
check the $GOBIN directory and it does not have all the binaries in there.  Seems
there is only 6cov, 6l, godefs, gomake, and quietgcc.  It doesn't seem to have
made 6g?
11:21 < zimsim> Do you have bison installed?
11:24 < zimsim> boomtopper, look at the http://golang.org/doc/install.html
page and check that you have all the dependencies installed.
11:24 < boomtopper> cheers I'll check that now
11:27 < boomtopper> Yep that was it.  Bison was missing.  Thanks for that
11:27 < zimsim> np
11:31 < wrtp> Kunkka: here's an example of using bufio.Read with a select
11:32 < Kunkka> wrtp: Thanks!
11:32 < wrtp> Kunkka: it uses two channels to avoid allocating a buffer for
every read
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11:58 < wrtp> Kunkka: on my machine, when the IO is nothing (reading
/dev/zero) and doing nothing with the data, the overhead is about 20% (575MB/s vs
11:59 < wrtp> that overhead would be lost in the noise if you were doing
something with the data, i think
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12:03 < mpl> wrtp: yea, here it is: http://pastebin.com/L1Pw7aM1
12:07 < xyproto> is it hard to find an example where log.Println works, but
fmt.Println fails?  Is having a go routine enough?
12:09 < xyproto> I heard that the advantage of log.Print over fmt.Print
would be in cases of concurrency
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12:10 < wrtp> xyproto: depends on the platform
12:11 < wrtp> if you've got two parallel instances of fmt.Println, they
might not write atomically
12:14 < xyproto> wrtp: So, letters can be outputted intermingled?
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12:20 < wrtp> xyproto: yes
12:20 < wrtp> i've seen it happen (on OS X)
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12:26 < wrtp> mpl: pipes are buffered, not synchronous.  the code looks ok
at first glance.  what isn't it doing that you want it to do?
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12:30 < mpl> wrtp: ah good to know.  that's the tricky part: sometimes it
does, and sometimes it doesn't (depending on the input), ie it doesn't output
anything (while it should, as I can see if I test with the same input by other
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12:32 < mpl> it drives me crazy, I can't figure out what's the problem...
12:34 < angasule> I see that there are many bindings for OpenGL and other
libraries, are those only for 6g/8g?  I'm only interested in working with gccgo at
this point, and if I got it correctly from my sleuthing, those bindings are in
cgo, and cgo is a 6g/8g thing only
12:34 < mpl> bbiaw
12:36 < exch> all of them require Cgo afaik
12:37 < angasule> how does one get around to making bindings for gccgo?  :)
I haven't found any references to that
12:38 < exch> No idea really.  I never use gccgo
12:40 < angasule> aah, ok, thanks :)
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12:44 < aiju> gccgo is evil ;P
12:45 < angasule> heh why?
12:45 < aiju> i don't see the point of having two compilers
12:45 < kimelto> having more than one?
12:45 * kimelto hides
12:46 < nsf> aiju: some say it's a good way to test the spec
12:46 < aiju> i say it's a waste of time
12:46 < nsf> I don't share that opinion though
12:46 < nsf> yeah
12:46 < nsf> writing more tests is a better idea
12:46 < angasule> I believe 6g/8g don't have plans for dynamic linking?
12:47 < aiju> hopefully not
12:47 < angasule> are you on windows or OS X?
12:47 < nsf> having shared objects in a language that does not specify its
12:47 < nsf> is a waste of time
12:47 < aiju> angasule: no, Linux
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12:49 < angasule> aiju: and you don't think fixing bugs in libraries just
once is a good idea?
12:49 < aiju> oh please
12:49 < aiju> not that crap
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12:49 < aiju> linux has versioned symbols to preven this ;P
12:50 < angasule> aiju: prevent what?
12:50 < aiju> fixing bugs
12:50 < exch> updating a library once
12:50 < exch> you have 900 different versions of the same lib
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12:52 < nsf> angasule: but what about _introducing_ bugs just once?
12:52 < angasule> exch: not really, you end up with just one copy of the
library per major version
12:52 < nsf> like it was with glibc
12:52 < nsf> and flash suddenly stopped working
12:52 < angasule> nsf: are you saying glibc is a bug?  :D but yeah, that's a
possible drawback as well
12:53 < angasule> nsf: flash on linux (and OS X, I'm told) is a piece of
crap, really.
12:53 < nsf> no, I'm more interesting about consequences
12:53 < nsf> angasule: I don't care
12:53 < nsf> the problem is that having shared libraries hurts more
12:53 < angasule> well, it's relevant, brittle software breaks easily, I
don't want windows-style crap
12:54 < kimelto> you dont have a libc.so on your system?
12:54 < nsf> but that was a bad example, glibc allowed more that it should
12:54 < nsf> there are other problems though
12:54 < angasule> there are many advantages
12:54 < nsf> I do receive bug reports some times
12:54 < nsf> when the right answer is "update library X"
12:54 < nsf> and as simple as that
12:54 < exch> It should prolly be noted that I am personally on the fence
about the whole static/dynamic linking thing.  I still haven't heard any argument
to persuade me either way.  They both of pros and cons
12:55 < nsf> angasule: name one
12:55 < angasule> if a problem is found in glibc, then you have to rebuild
glibc and relink everything, upload everything, and everyone has to download
12:55 < angasule> or a base library, not glibc
12:56 < nsf> you've described shared objects hell
12:56 < nsf> and you're saying they are good
12:56 < nsf> wtf
12:56 < angasule> it really sucks for distributions, and without
distributions you end up with the windows system, lots of unupdated apps and 100
different updaters, some of which are rather untrustworthy
12:57 < nsf> anyways, it's a very good thing that Go doesn't support shared
12:57 < aiju> deploying dynamically linked software is real fun
12:57 < angasule> nsf: actually, if you use dynamic libraries, if a problem
is found in a base lib, you have to rebuild the base library, upload only that
library, and everyone has to download only that library
12:57 < angasule> nsf: how about providing arguments?  unless you are not
interested in a technical discussion, tha'ts fine too
12:57 * kimelto breaks the ABI
12:57 < aiju> angasule: if you use dynamic libraries, if a bug is introduced
into a base lib, your whole system breaks
12:57 < nsf> angasule: yes, but if you instead of fixing it, introduces a
12:57 < kimelto> ka-boom!
12:57 < nsf> introduced*
12:57 < aiju> it works both ways
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12:58 < aiju> and holy fucking crap are there daily major security updates
of glibc or what?
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12:58 < nsf> angasule: I'm just saying that I've seen a lot of bug reports,
where updating to a fresh version of some crappy library, breaks others' people
12:58 < str1ngs> glibc is just a minor part of the issue
12:58 < angasule> aiju, nsf: that's possible, yes, that's why there is
plenty of testing, the point is that with dynamic libraries, you can fix bugs down
the road, with static, you can't
12:59 < str1ngs> rebuild static?
12:59 < aiju> sure i can, i just ship a new binary if a new bug is
12:59 < nsf> it's fucking horrible to test things with dynamic library
12:59 < nsf> because you can't
12:59 < nsf> users do that for you
12:59 < str1ngs> not much different then what you are suggesting
12:59 < nsf> you have no idea what version of that library end user has
12:59 < angasule> str1ngs: then everyone has to download every single
program using that library
13:00 < str1ngs> angasule: huh?
13:00 < nsf> ask firefox developers what do they think about shared
13:00 < aiju> angasule: i have a package managers for that
13:00 < nsf> and why their project has local copies for most of the
13:00 < kimelto> does the actual linked do link time optimization?  I mean
if you import a lib and use only 20% of the code, will 100% of the code lib be in
the final binary or 20%?
13:00 < kimelto> linker
13:00 < aiju> kimelto: 25% ;P
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13:01 < angasule> aiju: do you want your package manager to download 10MB or
2GB each time they fix a bug in a base library?
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13:02 < nsf> angasule: why do you think every package should be relinked
with base library again?
13:02 < xyproto> just downloading the binary diff, like Chromium/Chrome
would be nice
13:02 < nsf> they will if they have to
13:02 < nsf> bug simply cannot affect all apps at once
13:02 < kimelto> agreed, there is something ridiculous if you start to write
somall utilities like cat et all, and the binary are 2M size :>
13:03 < nsf> that kind of bugs get fixed quickly
13:03 < angasule> xyproto: they would have to keep binary diffs between all
versions, kind of a pain in the butt
13:03 < xyproto> angasule: at least it's not the user's butt, but yeah :P
13:03 < angasule> bbl, doctor is here
13:03 < str1ngs> kimelto: if you are talking about go, you can build with
13:03 < angasule> xyproto: hmm, go eat cookies :P
13:03 < aiju> angasule: it's not like we hear that kind of argument every
time there is such a discussion
13:03 < xyproto> angasule: ?
13:04 < nsf> frankly I don't understand how any developer may like shared
13:04 < kimelto> str1ngs: yup, we started there.  "-why 2 compilers?  - for
so support!  - what the hell?"
13:04 < nsf> I have a very small project, yet shared libraries gave me some
trouble even there
13:04 < str1ngs> kimelto: for this very reason
13:04 < str1ngs> if you want small binaries use gcc-go
13:05 < str1ngs> if you want easy to maintain go distrobution use gc
13:05 < aiju> hell, static binaries can be small too
13:05 < str1ngs> not really not with go.  unless you can strip
13:05 < nsf> personally I think something is wrong with the gc
13:05 < aiju> that was hypothetically
13:05 < nsf> its binaries are too huge
13:05 < str1ngs> but really who cares
13:05 < kimelto> and if you have symbols collision, welcome to the fun world
of -static :(
13:06 < aiju> kimelto: wtf are you talking about?
13:06 < aiju> that GNU tools have broken static linking?
13:06 < kamaji> Is it possible to put if conditions on multiple lines?
13:06 < nsf> kimelto: in Go symbol collisions are impossible
13:06 < nsf> at least in gc
13:06 < aiju> kamaji: yeah
13:06 < nsf> linker renames symbols at link time
13:06 < kimelto> nsf: I was refering to C
13:06 < skelterjohn> kamaji: yes - you have to end each line with something
interesting though
13:06 < skelterjohn> like a ||
13:06 < nsf> according to their import path
13:07 < skelterjohn> to not trick the semi-colon inserter
13:07 < nsf> kimelto: uhm, now we're talking about C?
13:07 < kamaji> ah ok
13:07 < kamaji> cheers
13:07 * nsf is in troll mode
13:07 < kimelto> nsf: we were talking about static linking in general
13:07 < kamaji> I figured putting () everything would force it to work
13:07 < kamaji> but it doesn't
13:07 < nsf> kimelto: what's wrong with it?  I think it's awesome
13:07 < str1ngs> kamaji: but I am making a gcc-go-snapshot and putting it on
aur if you want gcc-go :P
13:08 < nsf> because it has no interface
13:08 < aiju> one of the reason i like Go is that i don't have to put up
with gcc
13:08 < str1ngs> why there is gc
13:09 < aiju> calling the go compiler gc was one of the greatest design
failures of go
13:09 < skelterjohn> wher babby come from
13:09 < str1ngs> and thats why they have 2 compilers so you can pick what
suits you best
13:09 < kimelto> aiju: symbols collision in libcrypto and libmd which make
the program quit with a signal.  was fun to narrow it down to the real problem.
13:09 < aiju> str1ngs: yeah let's have two of everything to have people pick
13:09 < aiju> fmt1 and fmt2
13:09 < nsf> aiju: how about gompiler?  )
13:09 < aiju> nsf: haha
13:09 < skelterjohn> lol
13:10 < str1ngs> aiju: that's not even the case here.  but if people want
dynamic linking stand to reason a gcc front end would be better suited.  don't you
13:10 < xyproto> I don't know of any successful language that has only had
one compiler.  I think it's a good sign that Go have several alternative
13:11 < skelterjohn> kinda wish ergo wasn't closed-source/windows-only
13:11 < skelterjohn> i mean, it's written in go, right?
13:11 < aiju> xyproto: correlation does not mean causation
13:11 < aiju> skelterjohn: yeah but it suck
13:11 < aiju> +s
13:11 < skelterjohn> it might suck less if people could help
13:11 < xyproto> aiju: "a good sign" does not imply causation
13:12 < skelterjohn> aiju: he didn't say "quick write some more compilers -
that way go will be more successful!" :)
13:12 < skelterjohn> *that* would be abusing the causation/correlation idea
13:12 < aiju> skelterjohn: sorry it actually sounded like that to me
13:13 < aiju> i'm sleep deprived and try to compensate with lots of caffeine
13:13 < xyproto> aiju: how?  do you have specially crafted ears that hear
what you want them to?  ;)
13:14 < skelterjohn> aiju: you could just go to sleep
13:14 < skelterjohn> you're in germany, right?
13:14 < aiju> yeah, it's 15:17
13:14 < skelterjohn> it's what, 2pm there?
13:14 < skelterjohn> 3
13:14 < aiju> not exactly sleeping time
13:14 < xyproto> aiju: same time here :)
13:17 < skelterjohn> you guys are twins
13:17 < skelterjohn> now you have to be best buds
13:17 < aiju> haha
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13:20 < xyproto> yes, I will only call you aiju-bud from now.
13:20 < xyproto> brothers in timezones
13:20 < skelterjohn> well played
13:21 < aiju> hahahahaha
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13:29 < wrtp> mpl: you're using an old version of go - StartProcess has a
different number of arguments now
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13:30 < skelterjohn>
13:30 -!- femtoo [~femto@95-89-249-242-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #go-nuts
13:30 < skelterjohn> while it's true that java should die, i predict that
this will not be the way to do it
13:32 < skelterjohn> a gem from the comments: "Despite how humongous the JDK
is, the java compiler itself is relatively lean (only 140KLOC)."
13:32 < mpl> wrtp: fair enough, but that wouldn't have any influence on my
problem, would it?
13:33 < aiju> skelterjohn: HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
13:33 < wrtp> mpl: maybe not, but it means i have to translate your code in
order to try it out...
13:33 < aiju> skelterjohn: but actually, GCC is 2 MLOC
13:33 < skelterjohn> no one calls gcc lean
13:34 < skelterjohn> how big is the go compiler?
13:34 < aiju> 30K or something
13:34 < mpl> wrtp: ok.  no problem, I'll update in a bit and repost.
13:34 < skelterjohn> and doesn't gcc compile like 19 different languages?
13:35 < aiju> skelterjohn: oh, 76 KLOC
13:35 < aiju> oh wait, that's the c compiler
13:36 < aiju> 60 KLOC
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13:37 < hopso> I feel like writing a web app
13:40 < mpl> blimey, the tests are indeed freaking faster now that it's in
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13:41 < wrtp> mpl: it's ok, i've done it.  it works fine for me
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13:42 < xyproto> hopso: here's my first little web-app in Go, for
inspiration (?).  It's a canvas/javascript drawing app.
13:43 < wrtp> obviously the main prog exits before the sub-processes do
13:43 < wrtp> you might want to wait for the xargs proc to end
13:43 < mpl> yes, I've tried that
13:44 < mpl> wrtp: hmm, I've just updated to the latest release and my code
still compiles fine.  has startprocess changed again in the latest commits?
13:45 < wrtp> no, it changed a while ago
13:45 < wrtp> it has a ProcAttr argument now
13:45 < mpl> hg pull -r release ; hg update and rebuild is all I needed,
13:46 < mpl> (as in rebuil the go tree)
13:50 < wrtp> mpl: this works fine for me: http://pastebin.com/478yrTny
13:50 < wrtp> mpl: i usually do: cd $GOROOT/src; hg sync; all.bash
13:50 < angasule>
http://golang.org/doc/gccgo_install.html#C_Interoperability <-- useful!
13:50 < wrtp> ah, except you want to update to release tag
13:52 < wrtp> oh, you're right it hasn't been released yet
13:52 < mpl> aah
13:52 < mpl> fine then.
13:52 < wrtp> i thought it happened a while ago
13:52 < mpl> well, it has changed several times in the past
13:52 < wrtp> anyway, it seemed to work fine for me
13:52 < wrtp> i changed the code a bit to make it more straightforward
13:52 < mpl> yeah readding the wait didn't change anything
13:53 < mpl> don't get me wrong, it does work in some cases for me.
13:53 < mpl> but not always and that's killing me.
13:53 < xyproto> netchan.NewImporter wants a io.ReadWriter.  However, after
browsing the documentation, I don't know what would be suitable to use (ok,
something that can read and write, but I don't want to use a file).  Any hints?
13:54 < mpl> wrtp: uhm, why are you cloning the pipes?
13:54 < mpl> *closing
13:54 < xyproto> Is there a list of everything that implements io.ReadWriter
13:54 < wrtp> because you need to
13:54 < mpl> xyproto: nope, if you want to do a doc client that can find
that I'd be very happy.
13:54 < wrtp> otherwise xargs never gets eog
13:54 < wrtp> eof
13:54 < mpl> wrtp: well, I'm not doing it as you can see, so that might be
13:55 < wrtp> because the go process has kept the pipe open
13:55 < mpl> yep, I had some defuncts xargs, that explains.
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13:55 < xyproto> mpl: glad to hear I'm not alone in this quest :)
13:56 < mpl> xyproto: and I'm not the only one, afair.
13:56 < mpl> although now that I know the packages better I usually know
where to look most of the time.
13:57 < mpl> but I really think that's an aspect of the doc that is lacking.
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13:58 < xyproto> mpl: yeah, it would be nice.  I just tried googling
"site:gonuts.org io.Reader", but got no results.  That's strange.
13:59 < mpl> wrtp: yep, the Close() are exactly what was missing.  works
fine in all cases now, thx.
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14:00 < mpl> wrtp: except I get some defunct find as well, so I may need to
wait for it too.
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14:21 < xyproto> how come this code produces a runtime error?
14:21 < xyproto> I don't understand why.
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14:25 < exch> what kind of an error?
14:28 < exch> nvm.  just tried running it
14:31 < xyproto> panic: runtime error: invalid memory address or nil pointer
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14:32 < xyproto> and several errors including "gob", and various panics
14:32 < exch> yes I see
14:35 < exch> Ive never worked with netchans, so I dont know what it's
supposed to do, but shouldn't that importer connect to an exported netchan?
14:36 < xyproto> exch: yes, I have a server-app as well, that can export a
14:36 < xyproto> exch: I still think the behavior is surprising, though
14:36 < exch> I get the same errors you mentioned when I run only the client
code here
14:36 < exch> not sure whats going on
14:36 < xyproto> exch: but, first and foremost, I don't understand the error
messages or what part of the code they refer to
14:37 < hopso> It errors in netchan.ImportNValues() but the code seems
14:38 < exch> the app works if I rename MyData.Writer to MyData.Write
14:38 < exch> I think something, somewhere expects your type to implement
14:39 < hopso> Ah, it's the interface io.ReadWriter
14:39 < xyproto> exch: that's strange, as the ioReadWriter functions are
called Reader and Writer: http://gonuts.org/pkg/io/#ReadWriter
14:40 < xyproto> hopso: yes
14:40 < exch> xyproto: no, those are embedded interfaces
14:40 < hopso> Interfaces Reader and Writer, which mean Read and Write
14:40 < exch> ReadWriter embeds interface io.Reader and io.Writer
14:40 < hopso> Just below ReadWriter are the Reader and Writer interfaces
14:41 < xyproto> aha!  And io.Reader requires Read() and io.Writer requires
14:41 < exch> yup
14:41 < hopso> Yes
14:41 < xyproto> I see now the error of my ways.  Thanks!  :)
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14:42 < hopso> I wish go had a bit more clear error messages.
14:42 < xyproto> suprisingly long and hard to interpret error message for
one letter too much
14:42 < xyproto> woo, the code actually does stuff now.  :)
14:42 < hopso> :)
14:43 < xyproto> <3
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14:47 < Glasswalker> Just to confirm because it doesn't seem to say it
anywhere in a spec...  But can the destination in a Copy() be a slice?  (we
touched on this yesterday, but I'll be using it a bunch more in my code and wanted
to confirm so I don't need to backtrack)
14:47 < Glasswalker> eg: Copy(dest[100:200],src);
14:48 < exch> yes
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14:48 < Glasswalker> ok :)
14:48 < Glasswalker> just wanted to be sure lol
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14:51 < xyproto> Glasswalker: it's only lowercase copy() though, isn't it?
14:52 < exch> it is
14:52 < xyproto> Glasswalker: not to nitpick, I just want to learn about
Copy if there are two
14:52 < xyproto> exch: thx
14:52 < exch> io.Copy() takes only io.Reader/io.Writer as parameters
14:53 < xyproto> exch: nice, I see
14:58 < hopso> I just realized most of the jobs I could get for summer are
stuff like web design/updating and that's not my thing.  :(
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15:12 < kamaji> hopso: why only web design?
15:14 < hopso> No clue
15:15 < hopso> All other jobs seem to require knowledge more than I have
and/or previous job experience
15:16 < hopso> And I'm kinda scared of what they would expect from me if I
get a job.  :O
15:17 < exch> My job hunting experiences have taught me that being able to
show you are passionate about the work, and are a quick and eager learner, there
is a good chance any previous experience will not matter
15:17 < exch> nor will lack of any degrees/certificates
15:19 < hopso> I know, I just lack a bit of self confidence because I have
no previous work experience.
15:19 < exch> Even if the job requirements seem way 'out there', it never
hurts to try.  Just be entusiastic, show them some of your work and make sure you
have at least some basic understanding of what the company does
15:19 < exch> hopso: so did I at the time.  At some point, you just have to
take a leap of faith
15:20 < exch> the worst that can happen is that they deny you the job.  Just
move on to the next one
15:20 < exch> since you dont have the job now, you really have not lost
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15:20 < hopso> True that
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15:21 < hopso> I should just gather all my small projects and choose the
ones worth mentioning.  I haven't got many though.
15:23 < exch> It doesnt have to be many.  If they show various different
programming areas, that's all they will need
15:23 < exch> Put em on github or something, so they can read through it in
their own time
15:23 < hopso> Okays :)
15:24 < exch> The sad truth is that, if you can write a program (regardless
of what it is), you are already way ahead of the curve as far as the majority of
CS graduates go
15:25 < exch> pitiful really
15:25 < hopso> I know I'm in a good position because I already know
15:25 < exch> Many of em couldn't program their way out of a paper bag if
the universe depended on it
15:25 < aiju> exch: haha
15:26 < aiju> academic education sucks.
15:26 < hopso> Most of the second year students are simply wtfing around
when they should do something in Java.
15:27 < hopso> I'm so excited about those classes...  not.  :D
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15:27 < aiju> universities should stop being company training grounds
15:28 < exch> unlikely
15:28 < aiju> or rather weird crossbreeds between research and company
training grounds
15:28 < skelterjohn> it's what students want
15:28 < aiju> so you can't do neither properly
15:28 < zimsim> Well, Java is better than nothing.
15:28 < skelterjohn> the *want* job training
15:28 < skelterjohn> they
15:28 < aiju> skelterjohn: yeah, at the fucking taxpayers' expense, my ass
15:28 < skelterjohn> many of them, anyway
15:28 < skelterjohn> they want a meal ticket
15:29 < skelterjohn> i don't see what the tax payer has to do with this
15:29 < aiju> don't they have public universities where you live?
15:29 < skelterjohn> sure
15:29 < skelterjohn> oh tax money definitely goes in
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15:29 < skelterjohn> but our society decided that higher education is worth
15:29 < skelterjohn> so there you go
15:30 < aiju> society decided much bullshit ;P
15:30 < skelterjohn> i thought this was a discussion on the appropriate
target for CS programs
15:30 < aiju> Go?
15:30 < skelterjohn> that'd be neat, but a little too novel
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15:31 < exch> University of Hellsinki thinks it's ok
15:31 < skelterjohn> it also doesn't address the job training / "real CS"
15:31 < exch> s/hell/hel/
15:31 < skelterjohn> exch: a whole course?
15:31 < skelterjohn> 3 credits?  (or whatever the equiv is)
15:31 < exch> http://go-lang.cat-v.org/university-courses
15:32 < skelterjohn> one week course
15:32 < exch> aww only a single week
15:32 < aiju> skelterjohn: hell, universities teach Haskell
15:32 < aiju> has nothing to do with real CS either
15:32 < hopso> I'm applying to Univerrsity of Helsinki after my military
service.  :)
15:32 < skelterjohn> aiju: you have strange and wrong-seeming opinions,
15:33 < skelterjohn> i also think that haskell is a disgusting looking
15:33 < aiju> wtf?
15:33 < skelterjohn> but that doesn't mean it has nothing to do with CS
15:33 < aiju> oh sorry
15:33 < aiju> that wasn't opinion
15:33 < aiju> that was a typo
15:33 < aiju> i meant to say "real job training" or something
15:33 < skelterjohn> ah
15:33 < skelterjohn> then we agree
15:34 < aiju> Haskell is a very CS-y language
15:34 < skelterjohn> the programming academics in this department like it
15:37 < skelterjohn> a lot of students just want to learn whatever the
latest tech trend is
15:37 < skelterjohn> and be done with it
15:38 < skelterjohn> i mean, sure, have a course or two on different fun
programming languages
15:38 < skelterjohn> but don't have a course on java beans
15:38 < skelterjohn> or ruby-on-rails
15:38 < skelterjohn> or any of these other things that i know nothing about
beyond their names
15:39 < exch> there should really be more coverage of all the different
programming paradigms out there.  They all have their own areas where they really
15:40 < skelterjohn> at Rutgers we've got a course, "principles of
programming languages" that addresses that
15:40 < hopso> I'd love to see functional programming thaught in my school.
15:41 < skelterjohn> includes java (for OOP), scheme (for FP), prolog (for
whatever you call that garbage)
15:41 < aiju> skelterjohn: declarative and fuck you
15:41 < skelterjohn> haha
15:42 < skelterjohn> i ran a light seminar (reading group) on probabilistic
programming languages last semester
15:42 < skelterjohn> that was pretty interesting
15:42 < exch> there's dataflow-driven and concatenative to
15:42 < skelterjohn> i have no idea what concatenative might be
15:42 < aiju> exch: there are JILLIONS of paradigms
15:42 < aiju> skelterjohn: FORTH
15:42 < aiju> don't forget array languages (APL etc)
15:42 < exch> FORTH, Factor, Postscript, Joy
15:42 < Namegduf> My university has two programming units
15:43 < Namegduf> The first covers "what programming is" and uses two high
level languages
15:43 < skelterjohn> there is visual - if anyone has ever used scratch
15:43 < skelterjohn> though you could call it flow-based
15:43 < Namegduf> The second covers the various paradigms and uses Lisp and
15:43 < Namegduf> With mentions of things like Haskell
15:43 < hopso> Yay, my favorite project still builds fine.  It's totally
experimental and badly structured though.  D:
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15:56 < matsur> are errors like "unexpected fault address 0x875e4000" caused
by mixing the GC with C/unsafe?
15:57 < matsur> using Russ Cox's gosqlite bindings causes these to show up
pretty consistently
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16:16 < scyth_> http://pastie.org/1791693
16:17 < scyth_> does anyone have any idea why my Balancer() is not getting
anything at donechan ?
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16:29 < skelterjohn> matsur: can you make a small example that triggers it?
16:30 < matsur> @skelterjohn yes soon, trying to reproduce on amd64 now (was
on 386 previously)
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16:31 < skelterjohn> scyth: I don't see anyone reading your client's retchan
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16:31 < skelterjohn> so the worker might be blocking on
r.client.retchan<-, and never getting to the donechan send
16:31 < scyth_> client is reading it
16:31 < skelterjohn> oh nevermind found it
16:31 < skelterjohn> it's a lot of code to scan
16:32 < scyth_> skelterjohn, yeah...
16:32 < skelterjohn> i suggest you put a log statement before/after every
chan read/write, then you can see which ones are blocking
16:32 < scyth_> skelterjohn, sending *Worker from Worker.Run() to
*WorkFactory.donechan is blocking
16:33 < scyth_> and I can't figure out why
16:33 < scyth_> everything else works properly
16:33 < skelterjohn> so it's definitely trying to make that send?
16:33 < scyth_> yes
16:33 < scyth_> that's where it stops...  like there's no one to read it
16:35 < scyth_> I'm not confident that Balance() is catching it with select
16:35 < skelterjohn> is Balance() getting received from the reqchan every
16:35 < scyth_> yes
16:35 < scyth_> if I remove donechan <- w // in Worker.Run()
16:36 < scyth_> everything passes until all requests have been served
16:36 < skelterjohn> i am not certain about this, but it might be that when
it tests, if both the reqchan and the donechan have values ready, it will always
take the reqchan
16:36 < skelterjohn> i don't think it does anything nice like alternating
16:36 < skelterjohn> it's a race condition
16:36 < scyth_> that could makes sense
16:36 < skelterjohn> i'm almost certain the spec doesn't specify any order
16:36 < scyth_> since it all happens very fast
16:36 < skelterjohn> so the implementation can choose whatever order it
16:36 < scyth_> I'll try adding sleep() to clients
16:37 < skelterjohn> the easiest one would be top to bottom
16:37 < skelterjohn> try putting the donechan case first
16:37 < plexdev> http://is.gd/6YDFwY by [Robert Griesemer] in
go/src/pkg/go/ast/ -- go/ast: fixed bug in NotNilFilter, added test
16:37 < plexdev> http://is.gd/JzciVE by [Robert Griesemer] in
go/src/cmd/gofmt/ -- gofmt: avoid endless loops
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16:38 < skelterjohn> but your code is a bit too involved for me to grok the
exact flow
16:39 < skelterjohn> without me paying more attention that i really feel
like giving
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16:39 < scyth_> skelterjohn, putting done in front of req didn't help
16:39 < skelterjohn> i didn't think it would
16:41 < scyth_> I guess I'll need to figure out another route for the two
16:41 < scyth_> but this one seemed really nice :)
16:42 < matsur> @skelterjohn unable to reproduce w/ 6g...  i'll put together
a bug report shortly.  looks vaguely similar to
https://code.google.com/p/go/issues/detail?id=1620 is the 386 GC less stable than
16:42 < skelterjohn> no idea
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16:54 < hopso> I think it says amd64 is more mature in getting started or
16:55 < skelterjohn> scyth_: when i run your code, the select isn't getting
invoked after a while
16:56 < skelterjohn> and if i don't run your stats function, there is a
16:56 -!- keithcascio [~keithcasc@nat/google/x-jggoiynzoyfovrez] has joined
16:56 < hopso> "amd64 (64-bit x86, the most mature port)" @
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16:58 < skelterjohn> scyth_: I believe its a gomaxprocs issue
16:58 < scyth_> hm
16:59 < skelterjohn> i no longer believe it's a gomaxprocs issue
17:00 < skelterjohn> the line with "worker.requests <- req" is blocking
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17:01 < skelterjohn> yes, i see the issue
17:01 < scyth_> gomaxprocs fixed the donechan issue
17:01 < skelterjohn> er
17:01 < skelterjohn> not for me it didn't
17:01 < skelterjohn> i tried it at 10
17:01 < skelterjohn> but the issue is in Worker.Run()
17:02 < scyth_> I tried it with 2000 :)
17:02 < skelterjohn> you try to send something on donechan
17:02 < skelterjohn> but in the select in Balance, it's busy trying to write
something to the request chan
17:02 < skelterjohn> which is received from only once the donechan has been
sent to
17:03 < skelterjohn> 2000 doesn't fix it for me.  perhaps you made another
17:04 < scyth_> I mean, it fixes it in a way that first 10 or so requests
are properly delivered back to donechan, and then it stops
17:04 < skelterjohn> sure
17:04 < skelterjohn> those first 10 or so always worked for me
17:04 < skelterjohn> but then, i had gomaxprocs=2 at the beginning
17:05 < scyth_> so if I got it right, select is blocking on send to
worker.requests because all 10 workers are waiting on donechan
17:06 < skelterjohn> if you run this it might be more clear
17:06 < skelterjohn> but i think you said it right
17:07 < skelterjohn> (i just changed what got printed and when)
17:07 < skelterjohn> basically, two goroutines are trying to send to each
17:07 < skelterjohn> ie deadlock
17:08 < Glasswalker> if I initialize an empty string, and check
len(mystring) will it return > 0 (ie does it count the string terminator
17:08 < skelterjohn> there is no string terminator character
17:08 < skelterjohn> in go
17:08 < Glasswalker> ok
17:08 < Glasswalker> so then it will be zero
17:08 < skelterjohn> yes
17:08 < Glasswalker> until I put a value in the string
17:09 < skelterjohn> strings are immutable
17:09 < skelterjohn> you can just create new ones
17:09 < Glasswalker> right but if I have a type with a string field...  And
I create a new "mytype", then I do mytype.s = "Something"
17:09 < skelterjohn> right
17:10 < Glasswalker> the end result is that before I do the assignment,
len(mytype.s) == 0 but after assignment len(mytype.s) == len("Something")
17:10 < Glasswalker> right?
17:10 < skelterjohn> the underlying data structure for a string is something
like struct {length int, data []byte}
17:10 < skelterjohn> yes
17:11 < Glasswalker> ok :) thanks!
17:11 < skelterjohn> actually, not []byte
17:11 < skelterjohn> but *byte
17:11 < scyth_> skelterjohn, so I basically need to split 'receive new
request' and 'work' in my workers in separate goroutines
17:11 < scyth_> or introduce a mutex
17:11 < skelterjohn> scyth_: I haven't thought about a solution, but you
certainly need to eliminate the deadlock somehow
17:11 < scyth_> k, thanks
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17:16 < scyth_> yeah, it did the trick
17:16 < hopso> What kind of source code license should I use when I host a
project on Google code for my portfolio?
17:17 < skelterjohn> i like bsd
17:17 < skelterjohn> see http://github.com/skelterjohn/gorf
17:17 < nickbp> hopso: i like gpl3 for my stuff but its really up to you
17:18 < nickbp> random sidenote here's a good licence reference
17:19 < krutcha> there's like 4 million licenses all with the subtle nuance
of 'doesn't really matter unless you want to sue over it' :P
17:19 < skelterjohn> doesn't list the poetic license :\
17:19 < nickbp> also keep in mind that if youre using external code that'll
affect your choices
17:19 < nickbp> or if you want to in the future
17:20 < nickbp> unless its lgpl and youre willing to jump through hoops etc
17:20 < krutcha> so hire a lawyer now so that you can successfully host 100
lines of free code on a free site for fun/learning
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17:20 < nickbp> wut this is good stuff to know about
17:20 < hopso> krutcha: I sure will do that!
17:20 < krutcha> hehe :P
17:21 < krutcha> I agree it's good stuff to learn about, I just think the
whole thing's stupid
17:21 < hopso> Isn't MIT LIcense like "do whatever you want as long as this
license note remains"?
17:22 < krutcha> 2.3 million of the 4 million licenses are subtle variations
of just that
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17:24 < krutcha> it really boils down to whether you want to copyright or
copyleft your work, and whether you want people to be able to read, compile, build
with, link to or simply be aware of your code's existance
17:24 < krutcha> to help clear it up
17:25 < krutcha> vatican warlock assassins will spring forth from oracle and
delete you if you get it wrong, then claim to own your house
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17:27 < hopso> Why isn't there a simple "Public domain" option in that drop
down menu?  :D
17:27 < krutcha> GNU has several variants of GPL, LGPL, and AGPL licenses,
some backward and some forward compatible, some sideways but not necessarily
compatible through interdementional legal loopholes
17:27 < krutcha> so it's good they help to simplify it for the masses
17:27 < skelterjohn> hopso: You could probably put that as "other"
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17:29 < pharris> hopso: Some countries (eg Germany, IIRC) don't recognize
dedication to the Public Domain.  If you try to do that, it reverts back to
default copyright (nobody can do anything with it, more or less).
17:30 < skelterjohn> so as long as you don't care about germans (and who
does?), don't worry about it
17:30 < krutcha> then david hasslehoff will sue you though
17:31 < hopso> skelterjohn: Is the bsd license you mentioned same as "New
BSD license"?
17:31 < skelterjohn> no idea
17:31 < skelterjohn> i stole the license that go uses
17:32 < skelterjohn> i figure they probably thought about it
17:32 < skelterjohn> and i don't care to
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17:32 < skelterjohn> at the very least it makes my work compatible with the
go distribution
17:32 < krutcha> I cut pasted the license from the only other go project I
linked against
17:33 < Glasswalker> Several examples use strings.Bytes() to convert a
string into a byte array...  What do I use in placeo f that now (since that no
longer appears to exist)
17:33 < hopso> Quick Wikipedia lookup tells me it is.
17:33 < skelterjohn> Glasswalker: []byte(thestring)
17:33 < Glasswalker> oh lol
17:33 < Glasswalker> didn't think of that
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17:33 < skelterjohn> can go the other way too
17:34 < krutcha> re: licenses, I think gnu.org needs a wizard to ask you 10
questions then suggest the licenses that satisfy your needs
17:35 < Glasswalker> Hmm...  Think I made a bit of a mistake last night in
our discussion about interfaces
17:35 < krutcha> then to do away with the licenses, and make all licenses
multiple choice DNA encoded forms of your answers to those questions
17:35 < Glasswalker> So I have my Packet type, and I now want to cast it
into a ConnectPacket
17:35 < Glasswalker> I don't appear to be able to do that unless Packet is
an interface (Packet is a struct)
17:36 < Glasswalker> so I guess I do need to setup an interface
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17:36 < skelterjohn> Glasswalker: that was last night for you?  don't sleep
much, do you :)
17:36 < skelterjohn> oh wait
17:36 < skelterjohn> i got that crossed up with a forum post i replied to
17:36 < skelterjohn> sorry
17:36 < Glasswalker> lmao
17:36 < Glasswalker> I am pretty sure it was last night
17:36 < Glasswalker> might have been 2 nights ago though
17:36 < Glasswalker> lol
17:37 < Glasswalker> been sick last few days so spending my time off work
coding :) it's all kind of a blur
17:37 < Glasswalker> So yeah...  Think I need to define an interface then?
17:38 < skelterjohn> probably
17:38 < Glasswalker> So I have a value of type Packet, and I need it to
become type ConnectPacket...  How do I do that?  :) Can I just make Packet an
interface type (even though it has fields)
17:38 < krutcha> is your PacketType an interface?
17:38 < Glasswalker> it's a struct
17:38 < skelterjohn> you can't have an interface with fields
17:39 < skelterjohn> you can have a PacketBasics struct that all other
packet types embed
17:39 < Glasswalker> Hmm
17:39 < skelterjohn> and you can have this PacketBasics have methods to
satisfy the Packet interface, giving the other packet types default
17:39 < skelterjohn> then they'll all satisfy the Packet interface, and all
have the PacketBasics data
17:39 < skelterjohn> and behaviro
17:40 < Glasswalker> Hmm
17:40 < Glasswalker> ok packet has several methods (like 20-30) but each of
the packet types only have an Encode and Decode method
17:40 < skelterjohn> then this approach makes sense to me
17:40 < Glasswalker> oh
17:40 < skelterjohn> you'd only redefine the Encode/Decode methods
17:40 < Glasswalker> I thought to satisfy the interface all of them needed
to implement the methods
17:40 < skelterjohn> type A struct { B }
17:40 < skelterjohn> A has all of B's methods
17:41 < skelterjohn> which is different than "type A B"
17:41 < skelterjohn> where A only has B's data, and none of its methods
17:41 < skelterjohn> but the latter A can be converted to a B
17:41 < skelterjohn> where the former can not.
17:41 < krutcha> and also different than type A struct { x B } which has a
member of type B
17:41 < skelterjohn> right
17:42 < Glasswalker> ok right now I have:
17:42 < Glasswalker> type Packet struct { fields }
17:42 < Glasswalker> and:
17:42 < krutcha> but the wiggy part is visualizing what that means if A and
B have data
17:42 < Glasswalker> type ConnectPacket struct { Packet; fields }
17:43 < Glasswalker> so if I make Packet an interface...  and create a
BasicPacket which has all the fields and methods...
17:43 < Glasswalker> how do I define the interface "Packet"
17:43 < Glasswalker> (having a bit of a hard time getting my head around the
interface concept)
17:45 < krutcha> there's probably a concise and useful example of embedding
and GO's idiom for inheritance in that manner
17:45 < krutcha> but if it's on the newsgroup it would have devolved into
400 pages of bickering about what orthogonal means
17:45 < hopso> type Packet interface { Bytes() []byte; String() string; /*
etc */ }
17:46 < hopso> That's from memory, might be totally wrong :D
17:46 < Glasswalker> ok...
17:46 < hopso> Then you just actually implement the methods in BasicPacket
and it automagically implements Packet interface
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17:47 < Glasswalker> but does the interface specify ALL the methods in
BasicPacket (like all 20 of them) and then if I make ConnectPacket only have 2 of
those methods, that works?
17:48 < krutcha> if you don't implement ALL of the methods of an interface
on a data type, it can't be passed as that type because it _won't_ automagically
satisfy that interface anymore
17:48 < Glasswalker> ok...
17:49 < skelterjohn> the interface doesn't know about its implementations
17:49 < skelterjohn> the rule is: if you want to assign something to a value
with an interface type
17:49 < skelterjohn> that something must have all the interface's methods
17:49 < Glasswalker> ok
17:49 < skelterjohn> so you take all the methods that a packet *must* have
17:49 < Glasswalker> so I only define the encode and decode in the interface
17:49 < skelterjohn> and put them in the interface
17:50 < Glasswalker> hrm
17:50 < Glasswalker> this is making my head hurt lol
17:50 < krutcha> but I think embedding can help you here (correct me if I'm
wrong) but if you have embedded an unnamed member that does satisfy an interface,
you do too, but only on it's data?
17:50 -!- dahankzter [~henrik@92-244-3-192.customers.ownit.se] has quit [Quit:
17:50 < skelterjohn> krutcha: if you embed something in a struct, the new
struct gets all the embedded methods
17:50 < hopso> http://pastie.org/1792106 Like this, I guess.
17:50 < skelterjohn> so both the thing and the new struct satisfy the
17:51 < krutcha> right, but not with customized implementations unless you
re-implement them on the new parent type right?
17:51 < skelterjohn> Glasswalker: think of the interface like an API
17:51 < krutcha> ie if you add data and want those methods to do something
different, you have to clobber them
17:51 < krutcha> ?
17:51 < skelterjohn> krutcha: if you have type A struct { B }
17:51 < skelterjohn> then if B satisfies interface X, so does A
17:51 < skelterjohn> not necessarily the other way around
17:51 < krutcha> right
17:52 < Glasswalker> ok, so basically...  I think I'm misunderstanding (or I
hope) but if I understand correctly, I'm going to have to do a HUGE amount of
refactoring in my code to account for this...
17:52 < skelterjohn> one gotcha: if you have type A struct { B; C }
17:52 < skelterjohn> and B and C both implement the interface
17:52 < skelterjohn> you need to disambiguate those methods in A for it to
also implement the interface
17:52 < krutcha> but if B knows how to convert itself to a byte array, then
A knows how to convert the B part of itself to a byte array..  but if you added
data members to A, you have to re-implement the interface, for example?
17:53 < Glasswalker> Because I have a Packet Type (which has 5-10 fields,
and about 20 methods).  And several WhateverPacket types (such as ConnectPacket)
which each have Encode() Decode() and more fields...
17:53 < skelterjohn> Glasswalker: I have no idea how much you have to do -
it changes how your data types are used by other code though
17:53 < Glasswalker> I need to be able to freely convert from a packet to a
17:53 < Glasswalker> and the other way around
17:53 < Glasswalker> but I only care about maintaining the fields in Packet
when converting.
17:53 < Glasswalker> because encode/decode deals with that
17:53 < skelterjohn> krutcha: sure, the behavior of those composited methods
might be wrong, but they still exist and satisfy the interface
17:54 < krutcha> I have the feeling this is all very simple, all that's
missing is a concise example on go-lang to use for shared
17:54 < krutcha> a concise, useful, real-world example
17:55 < skelterjohn> concise and real-world don't always mix
17:56 < Glasswalker> Ok, might be easier if I have my real code to reference
17:56 < Glasswalker> http://www.pastie.org/1792121
17:56 < Glasswalker> line 52
17:56 < Glasswalker> is the Packet definition (DAMBSPacket)
17:56 < skelterjohn> so long
17:56 < Glasswalker> immediately below that are all the other WhateverPacket
17:56 < Glasswalker> (DAMBSConnectPacket and so on)
17:57 < Glasswalker> then beginning at 283 is the methods for DAMBSPacket
17:57 < Glasswalker> so a packet comes in with a bunch of binary data in the
Payload field...
17:57 < skelterjohn> i'm making an easier to read version of that
17:57 < skelterjohn> one min
17:58 < Glasswalker> I then need to convert it to the appropriate other
packet type depending on the value of the Command field
17:58 < Glasswalker> once it's the appropriate type, I then run Decode() on
17:58 < Glasswalker> which populates the new fields in that type from the
binary data in the Payload field
17:58 < Glasswalker> I can then work with those fields in various logic...
17:58 < Glasswalker> later when I want to send a packet, I create the
appropriate packet type
17:58 < Glasswalker> populate it's fields
17:58 < Glasswalker> then run Encode() on it
17:59 < Glasswalker> which builds the binary data in Payload
17:59 < Glasswalker> then I need to convert pack to a Packet type
17:59 < Glasswalker> to send it out over the wire (because all my
transmission and reciever commands expect a "DAMBSPacket")
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18:02 < Glasswalker> I guess I built this with the assumption that I could
derive a type, and it could be interchangable with it's "parent" type.
18:02 < Glasswalker> but that's OO thinking, and I know Go has a completely
different way of doing that...
18:02 < Glasswalker> Just a bit worried now that I'm going to have to hugely
refactor this to make it work...
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18:04 < skelterjohn> an easier to read version: http://pastebin.com/JWYAAxkj
18:04 < krutcha> go definitely has solutions around it..  but in that area I
find it difficult to unmuddle the documentation
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18:04 < krutcha> it's actually a good thought to cover that in the 'go for
C/C++ programmers' document a little better, might help unconfuddle us all :P
18:05 -!- joelkronander
[~joelkrona@c-bf2fe253.617-1-64736c22.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined
18:05 < skelterjohn> it was sort of an evolution that got stuck
18:05 < skelterjohn> originally we just had data and we had behavior
18:05 < skelterjohn> then we said "hey we can mix data and behavior!" and
lo, OOP
18:05 < skelterjohn> then java said "data and behavior are the same thing!"
18:06 < skelterjohn> and lo, the OOO (object oriented orthodoxy)
18:06 -!- rutkowski [~adrian@178235048012.walbrzych.vectranet.pl] has joined
18:06 < skelterjohn> go says "we have data, and we have behavior, and we can
tie some data to some behavior, but they're not the same thing"
18:07 < krutcha> when it comes to C++ the example of packets is well
trodden, and the is-a relationship of inheritence, and the implicit calling of the
most derived type's implementation make it very easy to do
18:07 < hopso> Did I miss something or could this be somewhere near what you
want?  http://pastie.org/1792153
18:07 < krutcha> *not wanting to get into a religious debate about how C++
is all wrong..  just sayin', it's easy to code what Glasswalker wants in that
18:09 < Glasswalker> right
18:09 < Glasswalker> and coming from a C++ programming background you can
see why I made the mistake ;)
18:09 < Glasswalker> (I'm an oldschool C++ Programmer who is interested in
converting to Go, but hitting a few conceptual hurdles along the way) :)
18:09 < krutcha> definitely, I am still making that mistake in go code and
working on solving these problems in a more 'go way' also
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18:11 < Glasswalker> hopso: But in that example, ConnectPacket wouldn't
impliment the Packet interface
18:11 < Glasswalker> or am I wrong?
18:12 * nsf smells a lot of C++ words on this channel
18:12 < hopso> ConnectPacket has all the same methods and field as
BasicPacket so yes it does implement Packet
18:12 < nsf> C++ is crap
18:12 * nsf said it all
18:12 < nsf> :D
18:12 < nsf> back to movie
18:13 < krutcha> I still think in 'is a' terms a lot.  So a myPacket 'is a'
Packet, therefore it contains a 'struct Header' Packet.Header, and a []byte
Packet.Payload.  It also inherits Packet.toBytes(), however it can override that
for its own data payload.
18:13 -!- boscop [~boscop@g227128090.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #go-nuts
18:14 < krutcha> in go, I've yet to see anybody as simply and concisely
describe this sort of relationship 'the go way' without it looking like a giant
unrelated list of foo bar foo bar(foo) bar's
18:14 < krutcha> yet, I think it can be done, just isn't generally
documented/explained well
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18:16 < hopso> How should I structure a code repository with two main
applications and three utilities related to the project?
18:17 < hopso> "src/cmd/application-name" like seen on few other go
projects?  :o
18:19 -!- boscop [~boscop@g227128090.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #go-nuts
18:19 < Glasswalker> Actually with further looking, it does look like
hopso's solution will work for me
18:20 < Glasswalker> I need to rename Packet to BasicPacket, and then put
the Packet interface in, which has all the methods in BasicPacket.  then it should
just work
18:20 * Glasswalker might have a bit of wishful thinking going on
18:20 -!- Wiz126 [Wiz@h187.120.232.68.ip.windstream.net] has quit [Quit: EOF()]
18:20 < Glasswalker> Off to try it :)
18:21 < hopso> Glasswalker: I hope it works :)
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18:22 < krutcha> thats a nice clean example, I like it too
18:25 < skelterjohn> does anything ever need to know more than
Encode()/Decode() while not knowing the underlying type?
18:25 < plexdev> http://is.gd/VkUgiq by [Brad Fitzpatrick] in go/src/pkg/io/
-- io: clarify that ReadAt shouldn't move the seek offset
18:25 < skelterjohn> if not, you'd only put Encode()/Decode() in the
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18:31 < Glasswalker> skelterjohn: Ok, first, didn't work...  Now everywhere
I'm referring to the Packet type (which is now an interface) I'm accessing
fields...  which the interface doesn't have...
18:31 < skelterjohn> that is not the fault of the design pattern
18:31 < skelterjohn> that's just you not refactoring properly :)
18:32 -!- m4dh4tt3r [~Adium@] has joined #go-nuts
18:32 < skelterjohn> if you had used http://github.com/skelterjohn/gorf you
could have done "gorf rename . Packet BasicPacket"
18:32 < skelterjohn> and then made your Packet interface with no worries of
collisions :)
18:32 < skelterjohn> </plug>
18:32 < Glasswalker> To answer your question, if I'm referring to a (lets
call it subtype) of packet, (such as ConnectPacket) it only references ALL the
fields (including those from Packet) but only the methods Encode and Decode...
the other methods are only ever run on a Packet
18:32 < Glasswalker> lmao
18:33 < Glasswalker> good to know :) I take it gorf is a refactoring tool
18:33 < Glasswalker> I misunderstood...
18:33 < skelterjohn> GO ReFactoring tool
18:33 < Glasswalker> lol
18:33 < Glasswalker> should have got that ;)
18:33 < skelterjohn> it's beta
18:33 < Glasswalker> anyway, I misunderstood the pattern
18:33 < Glasswalker> or I'm missing some key detail
18:33 < skelterjohn> presumably the packet subtypes call some of the
original packet methods, right?
18:34 < skelterjohn> in their encode/decode procedures
18:34 < Glasswalker> no they don't
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18:34 < Glasswalker> the methods for the original packet are only used to
prepare for transmission, or do pre-processing on reciept
18:34 < skelterjohn> what invokes the other packet methods?
18:34 < Glasswalker> there is a connection type
18:34 < Glasswalker> which handles the TCP Connection
18:34 < skelterjohn> what code calls these other methods
18:34 < Glasswalker> there is a RecievePacket method in that
18:35 < Glasswalker> it calls the other methods
18:35 < skelterjohn> don't tell me all about your protocol and design - it's
too much to internalize
18:35 < Glasswalker> sorry trying to keep it short lol
18:35 < Glasswalker> so the Connection calls all those methods
18:35 -!- boscop [~boscop@g227128090.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240
18:35 < Glasswalker> the methods are like CheckHash, and GenerateHash, and
stuff like that
18:35 < skelterjohn> and the connection can deal with the various sorts of
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18:35 < Glasswalker> no the connection only ever deals with a Packet
18:35 < Glasswalker> well
18:35 < Glasswalker> untrue
18:36 -!- boscop [~boscop@g227128090.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #go-nuts
18:36 < Glasswalker> the part which is calling the Packet methods only deals
with Packet
18:36 < Glasswalker> there is a goroutine in there which deals with the
18:36 < skelterjohn> if there is some code that isn't a method for a packet
subtype, or doesn't know the exact kind of packet it is dealing with, and it calls
a packet method
18:36 < skelterjohn> that method needs to be in the packet interface
18:37 < Glasswalker> hmm
18:37 < krutcha> skelterjohn: this variation summarizes some of my questions
I think http://pastie.org/1792297
18:37 < skelterjohn> and that is the *only* time
18:37 < Glasswalker> I think I'm missing something critical here
18:38 < Glasswalker> Encode and Decode are only ever called on their
individual subtype
18:38 < skelterjohn> not what i'm asking
18:38 < Glasswalker> the other Packet methods are only ever called on the
Packet type (never a subtype)
18:38 < skelterjohn> i'm asking about the code that calls GenerateHash(),
for instance
18:38 < skelterjohn> what code does this
18:38 -!- boscop [~boscop@g227128090.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error:
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18:39 < Glasswalker> http://www.pastie.org/1792311
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host closed the connection]
18:39 < Glasswalker> err
18:39 < Glasswalker> doh
18:39 < Glasswalker> lol
18:40 -!- boscop [~boscop@g227128090.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #go-nuts
18:40 < Glasswalker> it appears that's done from PacketFromBytes
18:40 < Glasswalker> lol
18:40 < skelterjohn> heh
18:40 < Glasswalker> yeah
18:40 < Glasswalker> PacketFromBytes does CheckHash()
18:41 < Glasswalker> GenerateHash is called from PacketFromPayload
18:41 < skelterjohn> but PacketFromBytes also creates the packet in the
first place, I imagine
18:41 < Glasswalker> yes
18:41 < skelterjohn> so they know the true type of the packet they're
dealing with
18:41 -!- firwen [~firwen@gex01-1-78-234-55-225.fbx.proxad.net] has joined
18:41 < skelterjohn> therefore they do not need to hold it in an interface
18:41 < Glasswalker> ok
18:42 < Glasswalker> but then how does PacketFromBytes return a random type
of packet
18:42 < skelterjohn> though it might still be convenient, if the function
can create one of several packet types, and operate the same way on any of them
18:42 < skelterjohn> its return value should be the packet interface
18:42 < skelterjohn> which I'll call PI for short, since Packet is
overloaded at the moment
18:42 < Glasswalker> ok
18:42 -!- imsplitbit [~imsplitbi@sccc-66-78-236-243.smartcity.com] has quit [Quit:
18:42 < skelterjohn> can i see PacketFromBytes?
18:43 -!- hypertux [~hypertux@vps1.joelegasse.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276
18:43 < Glasswalker> It's in the code you cleaned up
18:43 < skelterjohn> i cleaned that code up
18:43 < skelterjohn> it has no actual code in it anymore :)
18:43 < skelterjohn> i need the link to yours again
18:43 < Glasswalker> lol
18:43 -!- hypertux [~hypertux@vps1.joelegasse.com] has joined #go-nuts
18:43 < Glasswalker> then it's in the original pastie
18:43 < Glasswalker> http://www.pastie.org/1792121
18:44 < Glasswalker> line 243
18:44 < Glasswalker> and PacketFromPAyload is 271
18:44 < skelterjohn> it appears that your PacketFromBytes doesn't deal with
any of your specialized packet types
18:44 < skelterjohn> just the basic one
18:44 < Glasswalker> right
18:44 < Glasswalker> the reason this problem is coming up
18:44 < skelterjohn> is there code somewhere that needs to deal with a
specialized packet type, *and* call something other than encode/decode?
18:44 < Glasswalker> is that I only JUST wrote the first bit of code that
deals with a specialized type
18:44 < Glasswalker> everything else in the code deals with generalized
18:45 -!- boscop [~boscop@g227128090.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 250
18:45 < Glasswalker> skelterjohn: no
18:45 < Glasswalker> hold on
18:45 < skelterjohn> then encode/decode are the only things that go in the
interface, until that changes
18:45 < Glasswalker> let me get the code that's throwing the error :)
18:46 < Glasswalker> http://pastie.org/1792342
18:46 < Glasswalker> Line 24
18:46 < Glasswalker> is throwing the error
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18:48 < Glasswalker> And HandleConnect only cares about the fields within
the ConnectPacket type, it doesn't use any methods
18:48 < skelterjohn> ah
18:48 < Glasswalker> but the error of course is on the conversion between
18:48 < skelterjohn> that's because you can't convert one packet type to
18:48 < Glasswalker> right
18:48 < Glasswalker> but that's what I need to do ;)
18:48 < skelterjohn> that conversion would create new data
18:49 < skelterjohn> you have to write a function to do that conversion -
can't happen automatically
18:49 < Glasswalker> ok
18:49 < Glasswalker> so I don't need an interface
18:49 < Glasswalker> :)
18:49 < Glasswalker> just need to write a conversion method ;)
18:49 < skelterjohn> or your GetPacketFromX can identify the packet type and
create the appropriate kind of object
18:49 < skelterjohn> and return it in an interface
18:50 < Glasswalker> ok that's where you loose me again lol
18:50 < skelterjohn> sec
18:51 < Glasswalker> oh wait
18:51 < Glasswalker> lighbulbs going off...
18:51 < Glasswalker> one second while this train of thought completes lol
18:51 < Glasswalker> Ok...  so if I return an interface
18:51 < Glasswalker> I can't access any DATA on that.  (no fields)
18:51 < Glasswalker> but I can access it's methods?
18:52 < Glasswalker> because my problem was, when I was using the interface,
I couldn't access the data in the Packet
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18:52 < Glasswalker> which meant I couldn't determine which type it was to
cast it into the right subtype
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18:53 < Glasswalker> but if I wrote a "GetType" method which the interface
18:53 < Glasswalker> I could use that to get the type out, and then cast the
returned interface type, into the right packet subtype
18:53 < Glasswalker> or did I get that all wrong?
18:54 -!- virtualsue
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18:54 < Glasswalker> the other option would be to write a pile of
"converter" functions
18:54 < skelterjohn> http://pastebin.com/uvnqPysg
18:55 < Glasswalker> for PacketToConnectPacket() and ConnectPacketToPacket()
to get 2 way conversion
18:55 < skelterjohn> as expected, by the time i get back to this screen
you've written a book ^_^
18:55 < Glasswalker> lmao
18:55 < Glasswalker> As I said before...  you can't turn off my -V flag ;)
18:55 < Glasswalker> (well you could, by devoicing me in the channel, but
that wouldn't be nice)
18:59 < skelterjohn> one note, you probably want to be passing around
pointers to your data types
18:59 < skelterjohn> rather than value
18:59 < skelterjohn> s
18:59 < skelterjohn> otherwise you're copying the entire struct each time
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19:09 < Glasswalker> Ok, so in your example...  your returning a PI
interface type...  so how do I access the data from that on the other end
19:10 < Glasswalker> so when I call GetPacketFromSource() and get a value
out of it...  it's an interface type.  How do I access the fields?
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19:12 < plexdev> http://is.gd/bHqlrN by [Adam Langley] in 3 subdirs of
go/src/pkg/ -- bufio: add ReadLine
19:12 < Glasswalker> can I simply cast from an interface type into any of
the types which implement the interface?
19:12 < hopso> Finally created my first code repository ever :D
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19:17 < hopso> Sadly I can't continue with the project much until I get a
64-bit computer.
19:18 < hopso> I only have 64-bit Windows and the client application wont
run through wine or in virtual machine.  :/
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19:59 < skelterjohn> Glasswalker: yes
19:59 < skelterjohn> with a type assertion
19:59 < skelterjohn> thePI.(*Packet1)
20:00 < angasule> hmm
20:00 < angasule> this is a bit weird
20:02 < angasule> so...  I have main.go, package main, with a function Bye,
that calls a C function called hello, that calls the go function main.Bye
20:02 < angasule> now, that works just fine
20:04 < angasule> but, if I have meh.go, package meh, with a function Bye,
and I try to call that from a C function called hello (which is called from main),
I get a panic
20:05 < angasule> panic: runtime error: invalid memory address or nil
pointer dereference
20:08 -!- marten [~marten@82-170-80-86.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Quit: marten]
20:09 < hopso> Weird.
20:10 -!- femtooo [~femto@95-89-249-242-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #go-nuts
20:10 < angasule> yeah, I'm sending an email to the list, I guess :-)
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20:19 < coolaj86> I'm trying to compile go on ARM and I'm getting an error
in y.tab.h
20:20 < coolaj86> m4 --version 1.4.14
20:20 < coolaj86> bison --version 2.4.3
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20:29 < plexdev> http://is.gd/LzYEz0 by [Russ Cox] in go/src/pkg/os/inotify/
-- os/inotify: use _test for test files, not _obj
20:29 < plexdev> http://is.gd/MSxn9z by [Russ Cox] in 4 subdirs of go/src/
-- build: use gcc -Werror
20:29 < plexdev> http://is.gd/gJMqOF by [Russ Cox] in 3 subdirs of go/ --
build: tidy intermediate files during build
20:29 < plexdev> http://is.gd/OiBzDh by [Russ Cox] in go/src/libmach/ --
libmach: fix freebsd compiler errors
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20:45 < piranha> eh, I want map(func, iterable) so much...  :\
20:47 < aiju> there are for loops
20:49 < piranha> yes, but often they are much longer than what you could
have with map/reduce...
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20:50 < kamaji> skelterjohn: how did you set up your keyboard to do greek
20:53 < coolaj86> piranha: do you know who I should ask about errors when
compiling on ARM?
20:53 < piranha> heh, no
20:54 < coolaj86> it seems like every time I run ./make.bash it starts from
the beginning.  Any idea how to not do that?
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20:55 < piranha> well, I'm not an expert; maybe someone other has an idea
20:56 < aiju> piranha: i honestly don't think so (about map being shorter)
20:58 < piranha> times := map(func(r result) int64 { return r.time },
20:58 < piranha> for loop is 4 lines for this example
20:58 < aiju> well because you stuff everything into one line with map ...
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leva che succ...]
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20:59 < piranha> aiju: well, it's because it's small and simple
21:01 < plexdev> http://is.gd/tALb3s by [Rob Pike] in go/src/cmd/gofix/ --
gofix: fix embarrassing typo in osopen.go
21:01 < plexdev> http://is.gd/5JdiFb by [Russ Cox] in go/src/pkg/reflect/ --
reflect: inline method implementations
21:01 < plexdev> http://is.gd/YOjnYm by [Robert Griesemer] in
go/src/cmd/gofmt/ -- gofmt: minor refactor to permit easy testing
21:02 < plexdev> http://is.gd/HorB82 by [Robert Griesemer] in 2 subdirs of
go/src/cmd/gofmt/ -- gofmt: add test framework in Go
21:02 < skelterjohn> kamaji: i made a shortcut that changes it to all greek
21:02 < skelterjohn> via sweet apple stuff
21:03 < piranha> you can also just install greek layout and switch between
layouts with cmd+space :)
21:03 < aiju> i use xmodmap
21:03 < skelterjohn> that's what i do
21:03 < aiju> to type greek letters
21:03 < skelterjohn> except cmd+shift+space
21:03 < skelterjohn> cmd+opt+space i mean
21:03 < piranha> ah, ok then :)
21:03 < aiju> there is also SCIM
21:04 < aiju> and the other thing, i think it's called ibus or something
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21:11 < angasule> so, it turns out the package fmt was not being
initialised, as packages are initialised by being used (directly or indirectly) by
main, but Bye() was being called from C
21:11 < angasule> so, I now know how to call C from go and go from C, neat!
21:13 < exch> is that built with cgo or Go's c compiler?
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21:18 < plexdev> http://is.gd/xseX59 by [Brad Fitzpatrick] in
go/src/pkg/http/ -- http: flesh out server Expect handling + tests
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21:35 < plexdev> http://is.gd/JL8phD by [Robert Griesemer] in 3 subdirs of
go/src/ -- fix build: disable gofmt test script, enable gotest testing instead
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21:45 < hopso> I just realised how many little functions my older code has
that are already in standard library.
21:46 < hopso> I should just base my packet class on bytes.Buffer and I can
reduce the code to half.
21:49 < krutcha> there's also the newish gob package, and encoding.binary
etc that can be useful
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21:59 < hopso> Already using encoding/binary :)
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22:02 < hopso> Also I should separate my two servers.  Currently both are in
the same executable.
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22:07 < plexdev> http://is.gd/XGJCpE by [Rob Pike] in go/src/libmach/ --
libmach: fix the windows build.
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22:24 < plexdev> http://is.gd/yWecqG by [Robert Griesemer] in 8 subdirs of
go/src/ -- gofmt: gofmt -s -w src misc
22:31 < kamaji> whaaaaat, there's a Tron remix album :D
22:31 < kamaji> /offtopic
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22:33 < skelterjohn> i liked that movie
22:33 < skelterjohn> <3 olivia wilde
22:33 < skelterjohn> too bad the main character was played by an awful actor
22:34 < kamaji> It takes a really bad actor for me to notice, so it didn't
really bother me :p
22:35 < kamaji> but grooveshark has the remix album, listen to The Glitch
Mob remix of Derezzed if you liked the soundtrack
22:35 < kamaji> and let's face it, the soundtrack was the best part of that
whole film
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23:56 < plexdev> http://is.gd/RmeyE1 by [Nigel Tao] in go/src/pkg/image/ --
image: allow "?" wildcards when registering image formats.
23:56 < plexdev> http://is.gd/0cRzSA by [Rob Pike] in 3 subdirs of
go/src/cmd/ -- govet: make name-matching for printf etc.  case-insensitive.
--- Log closed Thu Apr 14 00:00:50 2011