--- Log opened Sat Jun 11 00:00:03 2011
--- Day changed Sat Jun 11 2011
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00:58 < saml> hey, how can I find type of a function?
00:58 < saml> let's say I did import "fmt", I tried to find fmt.go ..
00:59 < saml> do I just go to api documentation?
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01:01 < exch> you can use 'godoc fmt Printf' to see the documentation for
Printf
01:02 < exch> or run godoc as a webserver 'godoc -http :8080' You'll get the
same documentation as on golang.org
01:02 < saml> exch, hoa thanks
01:02 < exch> in fact, golang.org is godoc
01:02 < saml> is there auto complete?
01:02 < saml> i'm using vim or emacs
01:03 < saml> is godoc generated?  or someone wrote this separately?
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01:03 < exch> godoc is part of the Go distribution
01:03 < exch> it's a program you run from your commandline
01:03 < saml> yah but who wrote those documentation?  is it in the header
file or something?
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01:04 < exch> it's the code itself
01:04 < exch> godoc generates the docs from the sourcecode
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01:05 < saml> so where is fmt.go ?
01:05 < saml> nevermind i'm using binary go package
01:05 < exch> it's all in $GOROOT/src/pkg
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01:10 < saml> usr/lib/go/src/pkg/fmt/format.go
01:11 < exch> I have go installed in ~/go, which makes it easier ti find I
guess :p
01:12 < saml> i used distro's package manager to install go :P
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01:38 < Tv> golang.org pkg docs also link to source
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03:31 < _andre> hello
03:32 < _andre> in cgo, what's the best way to convert from a char ** to a
[]string?
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03:59 < zanget> http://blog.golang.org/2011/03/c-go-cgo.html
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06:58 < |Craig|> if I have 2 references to the same string, is a comparison
optimized to a pointer compare?
06:59 < Namegduf> No.
06:59 < |Craig|> so I'll have to use *string explicitly
07:00 < Namegduf> That would require string creation to guarantee no
duplicate strings ever exist.
07:00 < |Craig|> Namegduf: I mean in the case where they are the same
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07:00 < Namegduf> |Craig|: Ah. In that case, I still don't think so.
07:01 < |Craig|> I'd expect a string compare to check for differing lengths
and check the pointer (aka, check the internal string struct), then go to the
actual compare if needed
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07:04 < |Craig|> hum, if I use *string, I lose my immutability.
07:04 < |Craig|> I guess I'll stop my premature optimization and worry about
performance later :)
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07:44 < jessta_> |Craig|: that should be how it works and likely it
07:44 < jessta_> *is
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07:58 < |Craig|> jessta_: its nice to know my thinking makes sense, thanks
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09:45 < nsf> does anyone need an import spec parser for Go written in
python?
09:45 < nsf> http://pastie.org/2051429
09:45 < nsf> I just wrote one for my lang
09:45 < nsf> for waf
09:45 < nsf> dependency scanner
09:45 < nsf> and since my lang has the same syntax for import statements as
Go
09:45 < nsf> it may work for you too :)
09:46 < nsf> it nicely skips everything except import statements
09:46 < nsf> handles comments, etc.
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12:26 < saml> is there a repl?
12:26 < saml> or, how do you quickly test expressions or statements?
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12:28 < saml> what's the difference between [...]int{1} and []int{1}?  the
latter is slice and the former is an array?
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12:30 < uriel> saml: one is an array the other a slice
12:30 < uriel> saml: the playground should let you play with stuff:
http://golang.org
12:31 < uriel> there are a bunch of repls too:
12:31 < uriel> http://go-lang.cat-v.org/dev-utils
12:31 < saml> uriel, thanks
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12:50 < Tv> it would be nice if the http package gave a way for resources to
know what's "remaining" of the path
12:50 < Tv> similar to POSTPATH etc in cgi
12:53 < saml> is there longer version of for i:=0; ..  ? I tried for var i
int = 0; ..  but doesn't compile
12:54 < jlaffaye> declaration on a different line?
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12:54 < saml> jlaffaye, so,, scope of i is out of the for loop?
12:54 * saml tries
12:54 < jlaffaye> I dont know, I never use var to declare variables :)
12:55 < jlaffaye> anyway, what's wrong with i := 0?
12:55 < aiju> var i int = 0 should work actually
12:55 < aiju> also var i = 0
12:55 < saml> scope of i is in the for loop
12:55 < saml> slice.go:17: undefined: i
12:56 < saml> no, for var i int = 0; does not work
12:56 < saml> i prefer to be explicit
12:57 < jlaffaye> i := int(0) there you are
12:57 < saml> for simple cases..  it's okay..  but if the right hand of
assignement is complex..  then i want to declare i with type
12:57 < saml> how can I get reference for int, len...?
12:57 < saml> godoc doesn't help for int and len
12:58 < saml> like, type of int()
12:58 < aiju> type of what?
12:58 < aiju> the type of an int() expression is int
12:58 < aiju> also see the language spec
12:58 < Tv> saml: http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html ?
12:59 < saml> how do you search through spec?
13:00 < saml> int() is casting expression?
13:00 < aiju> yes
13:00 < saml> spec doesn't have word "cast"
13:01 < saml> programming so hard.  /me gives up
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13:18 < jessta_> saml: int() isn't a 'cast', it's a convertion
13:23 < uriel> nice, /r/golang passed 900 members:
http://www.reddit.com/r/golang/
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14:11 < Tv> i got a horrible urge to rewrite rest.go
14:11 < Tv> *sigh*
14:11 < Tv> it's almost good
14:11 < Tv> now i need to come up with a pun on the word "rest"
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14:58 < manveru> is there any problem using a Logger across goroutines?
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15:28 < mehalelal> Good day.  What type of bad things could happen if you
don't call netchan.Hangup after you are done with a channel?
15:30 < uriel> I'm not familiar with netchan, but I don't think it should be
a big problem
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15:32 < mehalelal> uriel: Thank you :-)
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15:43 < mehalelal> uriel: There are some negative effects.  If you don't
call netchan.Hangup, the port may stay open.  Not good :-(
15:44 < uriel> well, obviously, but that doesn't sound too bad, but guess
that depends on your deffinition of "bad"
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15:48 < mehalelal> uriel: Lol, I was hoping Go had a magic connection closer
:-).  It seems to mess up the program that calls importer.Hangup, no big deal
though, just a bit annoying.
15:53 < LiteralKa> LOL
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16:34 < Tv> just pushed a new web service unit testing helper:
https://github.com/tv42/mockhttp.go
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16:57 < kevlar> adg, iant, do you know if Go will be included whenever the
new GAE pricing plans take effect?
16:57 < kevlar> the Go runtime is not listed as a feature
http://www.google.com/enterprise/appengine/appengine_pricing.html
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16:58 < kevlar> (prospective search is there with the [experimental] tag,
shouldn't Go have a similar thing?)
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18:21 < edwin> hi, on a simple testcase gccgo is much slower than 6g:
raytracer (6g): 0m21.189s, raytracer (gccgo): 0m35.848s.
18:21 < edwin> In the gccgo case lot of time is spent in the GC
(runtime_mlookup, runtime_gc,), and __tls_get_addr too
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18:22 < edwin> should I file a bug against gccgo and 6g?
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18:44 < ghais> Hey guys, why does the compiler complain that Bar doesn't
implement Foo in this example https://gist.github.com/1020838
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18:46 < kevlar> edwin: you should probably email the mailing list.  GCCGO
and GC are two very different compilers.
18:47 < kevlar> ghais: you know, examples are a lot easier to parse when the
names are things that make sense.
18:48 < ghais> kevlar, I will keep that in mind
18:48 < ghais> thanks
18:48 < kevlar> in any case, the reason is because the functions don't match
18:49 < kevlar> (*Baz).FooBar(other *Baz) is not the same signature as
Foo.FooBar(other Foo)
18:50 < kevlar> if you make it (*Baz).FooBar(other Foo) it will work, but
you'd have to assert otherBaz := other.(*Baz) to be able to use any baz-specific
stuff.
18:51 < kevlar> (now do you see how lots of foos and bars and baz in an
explanation make it hard to understand?  lol.  It would be easier if I was taking
about zookeepers and cages or ships and cargo or something.)
18:51 < jhawk28> or cows
18:51 < kevlar> always a good choice
18:51 < jhawk28> lions would be nice too
18:52 < kevlar> python examples tend to use, what, sheep?  something like
that, right?
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18:56 < kevlar> oh no, python is ham and eggs.
18:57 < kevlar> (and spam, of course)
18:57 < ghais> kevlar, I see, makes sense thatnks
18:58 < kevlar> ghais: I should also point out that you'd be better served
with b := new(b) than having to do &b in a function call.
18:58 < kevlar> er, new(Baz) or whatever
18:58 < ghais> lol, how come?
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18:59 < kevlar> ghais: idiomatically, you want a variable to be a pointer to
a structure if you or anyone else will ever be modifying any of its concents
18:59 < kevlar> which is almost always.
19:00 < kevlar> or calling a function that has a pointer receiver, which
(again) is almost always.
19:01 < kevlar> b := new(Baz) itself satisfies the Foo interface, whereas
var b Baz does not.
19:02 < fzzbt> why don't they just remove new()?  it's redundant.
19:02 < kevlar> there are lots of examples of idiomatic code that uses this
sort of model; one good one off the top of my head is the bootcamp talk from I/O
19:02 < kevlar> fzzbt: it's not redundant.
19:03 < kevlar> make() and new() do two fundamentally different things.
19:03 < fzzbt> new(T) and &T do not
19:03 < kevlar> (bootcamp talk:
http://blog.golang.org/2011/05/go-at-google-io-2011-videos.html)
19:03 < kevlar> ah.
19:04 < kevlar> That is a much better argument than the people who want b :=
make(*T)
19:05 < kevlar> however, you can't make a pointer to a string or an int
using &, so you still can't ditch it completely.
19:08 < kevlar> one could make the argument that new() shouldn't be usable
on structs because &type{...} is much more readable when you subsequently
initialize it, but the counterargument (which would win) is that making arbitrary
restrictions is counterproductive.
19:11 < kevlar> ghais: have you read effective go yet?
19:12 < kevlar> there's a section on pointer and value receivers
19:12 < kevlar> !goego pointers vs values
19:12 < GoBIR> kevlar: Effective Go pointers vs values -
http://golang.org/doc/effective_go.html#pointers_vs_values
19:12 < ghais> kevlar, yeah
19:14 < skelterjohn|germ> hmm, i guess skelterjohn|germany is too long
19:14 < kevlar> there's also a section a bit further down about interfaces
which should help explain why you really want your variable to be a pointer so
that it can satisfy interfaces more easily
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19:14 < kevlar> lol.  skelterjohn itself required me to move my alignment
bar over a bit.
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19:15 < skelterjohn|germ> can't help it - it's the name my mother gave me
19:16 < skltrjohn|german> almost there...
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19:18 * Tv . o O ( in federal republic of germany, the germs pipe you?  )
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19:50 < Tv> goinstall or something to build a local source tree checkout?
GOPATH looks promising but the filesystem layout restrictions look annoyingly
severe
19:50 < Tv> +can
19:54 < skltrjhn|germany> you mean the go source tree?
19:55 * TheMue never thought that the App Engine integration is so simple.
19:55 < Tv> no, my own projects
19:55 < skltrjhn|germany> have you looked at gb?
19:55 < skltrjhn|germany> also restricts filesystem layouts
19:55 < skltrjhn|germany> in mostly the same way
19:55 < skltrjhn|germany> but doesn't use GOPATH which i find really really
clunky
19:55 < TheMue> skltrjhn|germany: Btw, why don't you take the internet tld?
skelterjohn|de
19:55 < Tv> skltrjhn|germany: i use gb but it's buggy
19:56 < skltrjhn|germany> is it now
19:56 < Tv> i mean stuff
https://github.com/tav/go/commit/13ca6b3b5c7fc27b713576651274c296982d094d refers
to
19:56 < skltrjhn|germany> if it's buggy you should report an issue so i can
make it less buggy
19:56 < Tv> skltrjhn|germany: well, the real story behind that is, gb has no
good story for "goinstall github.com/..."
19:57 < Tv> goinstall needs to be able to build & install this anyway
19:57 < skltrjhn|germany> gb builds local stuff, invokes goinstall for
remote stuff
19:57 < Tv> what's local to me is remote for others
19:57 < Tv> hence, i want to use the same tool for both
19:58 < skltrjhn|germany> i'm not sure what gb isn't doing that you want - i
have several goinstallable projects that i build using gb
19:58 < skltrjhn|germany> don't get me wrong, wanting to use the same tool
everywhere is fine
19:58 < skltrjhn|germany> but don't wrongly think gb is broken :)
20:00 < skltrjhn|germany> unless it actually is, then report and issue
20:00 < skltrjhn|germany> etc
20:00 < Tv> at this point, making goinstall work locally looks like a better
path; sorry
20:01 < skltrjhn|germany> what's not working about it?
20:01 < Tv> packages without sources make it crash, gb -t ignores build
errors, ...
20:02 < Tv> s/sources/non-test sources/
20:02 < skltrjhn|germany> i've mimicked its GOPATH functionality for local
projects so i'm pretty familiar
20:02 < skltrjhn|germany> Tv: these are great things to put in the issue
tracker - how am i ever supposed to find these bugs on my own?
20:02 < skltrjhn|germany> i'm just one man!
20:03 < Tv> me too and i'm not interested in coding gb when it's an
evolutionary dead end :(
20:04 < skltrjhn|germany> not asking you to code it
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20:42 < elazarl> I got the following error, when compiling latest go release
with gcc 4.6.0
20:42 < elazarl> lookup_unix.go:27: error: enumerator value for
`__cgo_enum__1' not integer constant
20:42 < elazarl> (a few of this)
20:42 < elazarl> Anyone have a clue?
20:43 < elazarl> It seems like cgo for some reason fails
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20:57 < uriel> edwin: if you search the list archives, I think iant has
mentioned the areas where gccgo is known to be slower than 6g
20:57 < uriel> edwin: one area is goroutines (it uses one host thread per
goroutine), and I know there was one other issue which I don't remember
20:58 < uriel> searching the issue tracker for gccgo issues also might be
helpful
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21:00 < elazarl> Any way to make ./all.bash build more verbose?
21:02 < elazarl> While investigating the problem with "enumerator value for
`__cgo_enum__1' not integer constant" I find that executing the makefile myself in
the pkg dir - works.
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21:11 < edwin> uriel: no goroutines used here
http://paste.debian.net/119567/
21:12 < edwin> will send a mail to the ML tomorrow
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21:20 < elazarl> OK, got it, env.bash forces /usr/bin to be before my own
path.  We need to test whether or not gcc is in a different directory, and add it
to the path
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21:52 < kevlar> elazarl: probing for non-$PATH gcc is a nonstarter.  The
whole point of $PATH is to let it be the definitive source of where to find
binaries.
21:53 < kevlar> there are plenty of really good reasons to not have a
particular version of GCC in your path or to have a different version in a
nonstandard path that's included first in $PATH.
21:54 < kevlar> also, not sure what you mean by "your own path" but I have
all of my own paths before the system paths and it seems to work fine (though I
don't have any personal copies of gcc in any of them)
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21:55 < elazarl> kevlar: When you start ./all.bash it uses ./env.bash to
change your path, and it prepends /bin:/usr/bin to your path
21:55 < elazarl> http://code.google.com/p/go/issues/detail?id=1946
21:56 < elazarl> kevlar: basically ./all.bash ignores your current path if
it conflicts with /bin or /usr/bin
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21:58 < kevlar> interesting.  I don't recall noticing that back when I was
poking around in those files.
21:58 < kevlar> it looks like it's there so that it can find make, but I
still think that's a bit odd.
22:00 < elazarl> kevlar: I don't understand why does it help use to find
make?
22:01 < elazarl> If the user don't have make in his path - report it and
fail
22:01 < elazarl> It should be his responsibility
22:01 < kevlar> I agree.
22:01 < kevlar> I also think there should be a dependency check before it
starts the build; compatible gcc version, flex/bison/lex/yacc, etc
22:02 < aiju> like ..  autofools?
22:02 < kevlar> god no.
22:02 < elazarl> aiju: You said a cursed word
22:02 < kevlar> it takes more time to get autotools working than it does to
help every user who has a broken install by hand.
22:04 < kevlar> afaiac, it could be a for loop doing if ! which $TOOL then
echo "$TOOL required, please install" && exit 1; fi
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22:05 < elazarl> kevlar: Nah, the output of this should be at least 200
lines long
22:05 < elazarl> to be compatible with autotools
22:05 < aiju> http://aiju.de/b/configure
22:05 < aiju> my autotools compatible replacements
22:06 < elazarl> aiju: I saw that, I didn't know you're the author...
22:06 < aiju> haha
22:06 < str1ngs> kevlar: I agree on the flex/bison/ed etc check
22:06 < aiju> i only wrote the first one
22:06 < kevlar> aiju: lolz
22:06 < kevlar> might even be faster than ./configure
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23:41 < uriel> waiting for the heat death of the universe is faster than
waiting for ./configure to finish
23:42 < uriel> (reason 345 why I love Go: no auto-hell in sight)
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23:51 < kevlar> uriel: I still think we need to work on making Go
self-hosting
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23:52 < kevlar> and I am still really twitchy about the whole parallel
compiler thing
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23:57 < uriel> it is just a question of priorities and time, making Go
self-hosting would be great, but would make bootstrapping much harder, so I think
that can wait until the current environment has been packaged and distributed
widely
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23:58 < kevlar> my worry is that a compiler written in go would be
perpetually hamstrung because it won't have the optimizations we're getting ready
to add in the c compilers
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23:59 < nsf> I don't think bootstraping will be a problem
23:59 < nsf> Go compiler generates static binaries that work everywhere
23:59 < kevlar> that's my thought too
23:59 < nsf> and you can always compile the compiler once to assembly and
use assembler for bootstrapping if binaries doesn't work
--- Log closed Sun Jun 12 00:00:46 2011