--- Log opened Thu Jun 23 00:00:53 2011
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01:33 < grafa> guys is anyone using mgo (the go mongo driver)?
01:33 < grafa> I am trying to figure out how to convert to ISODate and store
as ISODate
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02:04 < grafa> anyone?
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04:52 < graftenberg> has anyone used mgo (the mongodb package)?
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04:54 < graftenberg> I am trying to get the ID field right after insert...
hell I can't even get the ID field anyways
04:54 < graftenberg> any ideas?
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05:28 < Dazedit> Hello, I have a quick question.  I'm seeing this debugPrint
function in this module I'm working with, I'm wondering what that prints to or if
there is anywhere I can find out more about it?
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05:36 < vegai> you could always look at the source
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05:40 < Dazedit> I just found it.  It turned out to be at the end of the
file.  I swear it wasn't there the first time I looked, I blame fatigue.  Thank
you.
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05:53 < TripleC> Hi, I am a newbie on GO
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06:23 < iwinulose> Hey all…suggestions for an interesting first Go project?
Brain coming up empty
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06:24 < ijknacho> iwinulose: port something you've written in another lang?
06:25 < iwinulose> ijknacho: hmmm that could work...
06:26 < iwinulose> I wrote a pretty simple DVCS about a year ago
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07:30 < iwinulose_> is the inotify package present cross-platform, or is it
linux-specific?
07:30 < iwinulose_> (inotify itself is obviously a linuxism, though fsevent
on OSX could be used for the same thing...)
07:30 < zanget> well isn't inotify only on linux
07:30 < zanget> it's linux only
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07:31 < iwinulose_> zanget: sad day; thanks
07:31 < zanget> there is kevent in a different package
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07:37 < iwinulose_> I mean if I were really committed I could also try and
figure out how to wrap the libdispatch stuff, but that seems a bit out of scope.
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08:01 < iwinulose_> zanget: i may be dense; you say there's a kevent
library?
08:02 < iwinulose_> If so I'm not finding it :-/
08:06 < Dazedit> iwinulose_: the pkg/net/fd_freebsd.go seems to handle
kevent/kqueue.
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08:07 < zanget> also http://golang.org/pkg/syscall/
08:09 < iwinulose_> Dazedit, zanget: thanks
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08:19 < iwinulose_> correct me if I'm wrong: taking an argument of type
Interface essentially means "takes anything" akin to "void *" or "Object" or "id"
08:21 < iwinulose_> ah I misread the documentation slightly, though i guess
the question is still valid if you s/Interface/interface{}/
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08:23 < iwinulose_> can you therefore bind a method to any object by
declaring func (i *interface{}) whatever(args) retType {}
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08:25 < aiju> iwinulose_: no
08:26 < aiju> iwinulose_: such a method is called a function ;P
08:26 < aiju> func whatever(i *interface{}, args)
08:27 < jessta> iwinulose_: it's not really a 'takes anything', it's an
interface with zero methods and any type will satisfy an interface with zero
methods
08:28 < iwinulose_> aiju: is it impossible, or merely not done?  I'm just
probling asking I'm new to the language?
08:28 < aiju> iwinulose_: it's impossible
08:28 < jessta> iwinulose_: you can't put methods on interfaces
08:29 < iwinulose_> thanks
08:29 < aiju> iwinulose_: you can only put methods on types you defined
yourself
08:30 * iwinulose_ mutters about OCP
08:30 < iwinulose_> oops my above question had 1 too many ?
08:30 < iwinulose_> xD
08:31 < aiju> OCP?
08:31 < aiju> object child porn?
08:31 < aiju> sounds like a C++ feature
08:31 < iwinulose_> aiju: open closed principle
08:31 < iwinulose_> aiju: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open/closed_principle
08:32 < aiju> hm whatever
08:32 < aiju> i rather write code ;P
08:33 < iwinulose_> suppose for example i wanted an easy way to ask any
object to print its address out, and I'm lazy and don't like to write
fmt.Printf("%p\n", obj)
08:33 < iwinulose_> it'd be nice to just have func (obj *interface{})
printAddr() {}
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08:34 < aiju> the question is whether this is even possible with the current
dispatching scheme
08:34 < iwinulose_> or if you have a type given from another library and you
want to extend it in some way (think objective-c categories if you've worked with
them)
08:34 < aiju> you can't extend types from other libraries
08:34 < iwinulose_> aiju: i don't know--haven't dug around in the runtime
08:35 < aiju> iwinulose_: you can just write a function
08:35 < iwinulose_> aiju: right I got that above--I'm illustrating how it
could be useful
08:35 < aiju> func printAddr(a interface{})
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08:35 < aiju> Go code doesn't just randomly stick methods on everything like
some other languages
08:36 < iwinulose_> I don't want to get into a flame war--im just checking
teh language out :-/
08:36 < aiju> this is my normal manner of speaking
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08:40 < Triple3C> Access to Go runtime in Google App Engine Thank you for
your interest in using Go in Google App Engine!Please provide the following
information to be added to the waitlist for enabling your app for the Go runtime.
We will contact you when access is granted, although we may not be able to give
access to everyone.
08:41 < Triple3C> I got this message.
08:41 < aiju> i think it means ..  just what it says!
08:41 < mpl> aiju: "I'd rather write code" is pretty much how I finish most
meetings with my colleagues.  or even how I try to explain them how we don't need
meetings as long as we haven't even tried writing the stuff.  :/
08:41 < aiju> haha
08:42 < Triple3C> Does the GAE provide the GO code for every one using?
08:42 < aiju> it's Go, not GO and what the fuck do you mean?
08:43 < aiju> mpl: i have no clue why other people fill whiteboards just to
write programs
08:43 < aiju> i'd rather write code
08:43 < iwinulose_> mpl, aiju: tbf type extension is very useful
08:43 < aiju> tbf?
08:43 < iwinulose_> to be fair
08:44 < mpl> aiju: exactly.  although I like writing on the board some
trivial tests example, I'm having trouble with juggling numbers in my head.
08:44 < iwinulose_> it can be abused, but what if (real world example)
you're given back a color object which doesn't ahve predefined constructors for
basic colors or for conversions between teh colorspaces you're working in.
08:44 < aiju> mpl: yeah ..  there are uses
08:45 < iwinulose_> its much nicer to be able to add these things to a
library class and move on rather than rolling your own via
composition/extension/hackery
08:45 < aiju> iwinulose_: i hardly use libraries in my code
08:45 < iwinulose_> bug or feature
08:45 < aiju> saves me lot of time trying to find a suitable library
08:46 < aiju> and then noticing halfway through that it doesn't really
provide what i need
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08:47 < mpl> aiju: what puzzles me is when a colleague is sitting for one
day "thinking on how to do this smartly" when we have to port some fortran code
into c++.  I'd just do the damn thing and stop to think if a problem arises...
08:47 < aiju> haha
08:47 < mpl> design patterns books are a curse.
08:47 < aiju> mpl: i spend the time other people waste that time with
trolling on IRC
08:47 < aiju> so it's about even#
08:48 < mpl> ppl think they must find a design pattern for every damn thing.
08:48 < aiju> if you just read that as "eve", you spent too much time with
UNIX :)
08:48 < aiju> mpl: there is a good quote on that
08:48 < aiju> "design patterns" are concepts used by people who can't learn
by any method except memorization, so in place of actual programming ability, they
memorize "patterns" and throw each one in sequence at a problem until it works
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08:48 < aiju> — Dark_Shikari
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08:50 < mpl> well, I can't throw the stone at them because I probably
wouldn't write better code than they do with this method.  but I'd rather improve
myself by thinking and learning by example and trial and error.
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08:55 < ijknacho> iwinulose: I think you can do what I think you'd want to
do with the color object example
08:56 < ijknacho> assuming you had some package foo w/ type Color struct,
and another package bar that was extending Color w/ convienence ctors
08:58 < iwinulose_> ijknacho: essentially by composing the object?
08:58 < ijknacho> you don't need composition
08:58 < ijknacho> let me explain my trivial example a bit
08:59 < iwinulose_> (I mean plenty of languages don't have this kind of
feature--Java, C++ come to mind--but the Go syntax seems to suggest that you
should be able to)
08:59 < iwinulose_> ijknacho:
08:59 < iwinulose_> please do :-)
08:59 < ijknacho> assuming the orig package foo that defined Color exposed a
ctor NewColor(code int)
08:59 < ijknacho> and assuming what you wanted was for some package bar to
defined convienence constructors for foo.Color objects...
08:59 < iwinulose_> (the new and make keywords are only used for builtin
types?)
09:00 < ijknacho> make is for slices/maps, new is for builtins and structs
09:00 < iwinulose_> right just making sure
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09:01 < ijknacho> my point, though, is that from bar, you could do: func
NewColorBlah(blah int) *Color { return foo.NewColor(blahToCodeConversion(blah)) }
09:02 < ijknacho> perhaps you're referring to that as composition, dunno
09:02 < ijknacho> the 'new' keyword allocates space for type and zeros
it--if you want initialization, you're gonna define a NewBlah() style func
09:03 < ijknacho> small error in my example--NewColorBlah should return a
*foo.Color
09:04 < iwinulose_> ijknacho: well kinda.  ionno.  I gotta take a shower
then go to bed (idk where you are, but it's 2AM here and I have work tomorrow)
09:04 < ijknacho> it's easy enough to test this out.  have fun.
09:05 < iwinulose_> thx
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09:26 < zippoxer> ijknacho: Color{} will initialize, no need for NewBlah()
09:26 < ijknacho> zippoxer: understood, given my example.
09:27 < ijknacho> I should have put in a private field so that it'd be
logical to have a NewColor* style ctor.
09:28 < zippoxer> calling Color{somePrivateField: ""} won't work from
outside package?
09:28 < ijknacho> Not as far as I understand.
09:29 < ijknacho> I think you'll get an error about unexported fields.
09:30 < zippoxer> let's say Color struct has 3 field, the second private.
09:30 < zippoxer> you want to initialize it like this:
09:30 < zippoxer> Color{"Red", "value for the private field", "whatever"}
09:30 < zippoxer> it must not return error
09:31 < ijknacho> from inside the package defining Color, sure.  from
outside, you'd have to do that kind of init by pointer, and you'd have to use
named fields, because you couldn't set the second private field.
09:31 < zippoxer> ohh okay
09:32 < ijknacho> from outside, you could do: c := &Color{nameOfField1:
"blah", nameOfField3: "blah3"}
09:32 < zippoxer> and the private field would be nil right?
09:33 < ijknacho> well, you'd need to preface a package name like
&foo.Color, because ostensibly Color is implemented in some other package
09:33 < zippoxer> yeah lol
09:34 < iwinulose_> sorry question on a different subject xD.  what's the
difference between declaring a method on a pointer to a type vs the type itself?
09:34 < iwinulose_> (ffff need to sleep)
09:34 < aiju> iwinulose_: call by value vs.  call by reference
09:35 < iwinulose_> what does it mean to call by value?  it builds a
copy/otherwise makes the reciever immutable and invokes the method on it?
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09:36 < iwinulose_> e.g.  if I have a type T and a func (t T) whatever() {}
vs func (t *T) whatever2() {} whatever cannot permute a reciever's state and
whatever2 can, since whatever2 is "by reference" whereas whatever1 is by value?
09:37 < aiju> iwinulose_: copies
09:37 < ijknacho> iwinulose:
http://groups.google.com/group/golang-nuts/browse_thread/thread/0f5301796dcc5e82
09:39 < aiju> hahaha
09:39 < aiju> rob pike's post
09:39 < aiju> way awesome
09:39 < iwinulose_> im confused why it exists is all...if it was to have the
equivalent of a const method I'd understand but then there'd be no need to copy
09:39 < aiju> This is not rocket science.  It's barely even computer
science.
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09:39 < aiju> iwinulose_: sometimes you have objects which you use mostly as
values
09:39 < aiju> then it's convenient
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09:40 < aiju> think of e.g.  polynomials
09:40 < iwinulose_> I love how every language plays the same tricks xD
09:41 < aiju> i like how Go avoids magic
09:41 < zippoxer> YEAH!
09:41 < zippoxer> I hate magic
09:42 < iwinulose_> aiju: what do you call magic?
09:42 < zippoxer> that's why I always prefered python over ruby
09:42 < iwinulose_> zippoxer++
09:42 < iwinulose_> *that* kind of magic
09:42 < zippoxer> magic is when the api is guessing what you wanna do, by
just one or two details you give him
09:42 < aiju> iwinulose_: no, i mean "magical" behaviour of somethings
09:43 < aiju> or the kind of thing zippoxer is talkinga bout
09:43 < iwinulose_> what does "magical" mean
09:43 < iwinulose_> in that sentence
09:43 < zippoxer> similar to auto completion
09:43 < aiju> like method receivers are magical arguments
09:43 < iwinulose_> did you read rob pikes post?
09:43 < iwinulose_> they are
09:43 < aiju> no
09:44 < iwinulose_> k bro
09:44 < aiju> method receivers are just normal arguments with a different
syntax
09:44 < aiju> no magic
09:45 < zippoxer> also exceptions is something go avoids
09:45 < iwinulose_> zippoxer: so i hear, though I havent yet had to deal
with that
09:45 < aiju> you don't deal with Go exceptions
09:45 < zippoxer> it's runtime only
09:45 < aiju> they happen and then you scream "FUCK"
09:45 < zippoxer> mostly*
09:45 < zippoxer> lol
09:46 < aiju> Go programs should never, ever, panic under normal operation
09:46 < iwinulose_> honestly exceptions are nice, but should only be used in
exceptional cases.  The escape logic for exceptions is by definition tricky
09:46 < zippoxer> yeah exceptions should not happen when you validate user
input or things like that
09:46 < aiju> or reach the end of a list
09:46 < aiju> like a certain other programming language
09:47 < zippoxer> java almost killed me
09:47 < aiju> in soviet zippoxia, java kills you
09:47 < zippoxer> :P
09:47 < iwinulose_> Go has null, right?
09:47 < aiju> killall java # half memory usage
09:47 < zippoxer> nil
09:47 < aiju> iwinulose_: yes, 0
09:47 < aiju> ;P
09:47 < iwinulose_> xD
09:48 < iwinulose_> modern languages shouldnt
09:48 < zippoxer> yeah java uses TONS
09:48 < zippoxer> of mem
09:48 < zippoxer> it almost doesn't clean it
09:48 < iwinulose_> at the very least there should be a keyword to specify a
nonnull reference, where any assignment to a null value is a runtime error
09:48 < zippoxer> the vm*
09:48 < aiju> iwinulose_: you mean NULL?
09:48 < aiju> a null pointer is nil
09:48 < aiju> the number null is 0 ;)
09:49 < iwinulose_> use whatever semantic lets u sleep at night
09:49 < aiju> 11:53 < iwinulose_> at the very least there should be a
keyword to specify a nonnull reference, where any assignment to a null value is a
runtime error
09:49 < aiju> i'm not sure what you mean
09:49 < aiju> dereferencing a null pointer panics
09:51 < zippoxer> python should adapt the word Panic instead of Exception
09:51 < zippoxer> extremely easy to write
09:51 < zippoxer> and read
09:51 < zippoxer> and all the point about python is easiness, it has nothing
else special..
09:51 < iwinulose_> aiju: you should be able to at least specify something
akin to "nonnil" or "nonnull" in an objects type
09:51 < iwinulose_> e.g.
09:52 < iwinulose_> ip *int nonnil
09:52 < aiju> iwinulose_: why would you do that?
09:52 < iwinulose_> "should" is not what I mean...  I would like a language
which supports this feature.
09:52 < Tonnerre> If you want to write SQL, write SQL, not Go?
09:53 < aiju> haha
09:53 < aiju> if you want SQL, you know where to find it
09:53 < aiju> i can't really tell how "nonnil" is supposed to work
09:53 < aiju> sophisticated static analysis?
09:53 < iwinulose_> aiju: many reasons.  at top level, i don't have to write
null checks all over my production code
09:54 < aiju> why do you write null checks
09:54 < zippoxer> will there ever be a brilliant alternative to SQL...
09:54 < vegai> have you checked linq?
09:54 < zippoxer> you talk about C#?
09:54 < aiju> either the hardware catches null exceptions or you should
check and provide a nice user message
09:54 < vegai> zippoxer: yep.
09:54 < zippoxer> vegai: but it's not that easier than plain SQL...
09:54 < iwinulose_> aiju: where do you work?
09:55 < aiju> iwinulose_: nowhere ;P
09:55 < iwinulose_> kk
09:55 < aiju> iwinulose_: if you just do if x == nil { panic("FUUUCK NULL
POINTER") } you can as well have Go handle that
09:56 < vegai> zippoxer: sql ain't that hard
09:56 < vegai> unless you wanna do difficult things
09:56 < vegai> but nothing in the world will make difficult things easy
09:56 < iwinulose_> itd be nice to not have to do that (a)
09:56 < iwinulose_> b) a lot of bugs would be caught earlier
09:56 < iwinulose_> stupid and not so stupid ones
09:56 < vegai> ok, that was a bit exaggerating
09:56 < iwinulose_> by static analysis
09:57 < iwinulose_> the rest done by the runtime and explicitly marked as
unsafe access
09:57 < aiju> iwinulose_: be grateful that your hardware complains about
null pointers ..
09:57 < iwinulose_> aiju: how does that work?  (on x86)
09:57 < iwinulose_> (or _64)
09:58 < aiju> on x86(_64) a page fault trap happens
09:58 < Tonnerre> iwinulose_: there's a red tape page mapped to address 0
09:58 < aiju> Tonnerre: no, there is no page at address 0
09:58 < Tonnerre> iwinulose_: if you try to access that page, you fault
09:58 < iwinulose_> aiju: well first theres a TLB miss
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09:58 < aiju> on VAX you simply get some bullshit number :)
09:58 < ijknacho> hardware exception, handled by kernel, conveyed by kernel
to process.  segfault.
09:58 < aiju> iwinulose_: from a programmer's point of view, x86 has no TLB
09:58 < iwinulose_> followed by a PDE walk to 0
09:58 < aiju> iwinulose_: unlike MIPS, the x86 TLB is completely transparent
09:59 < Tonnerre> aiju: well ok, depending on the implementation; it doesn't
make much of a difference though
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09:59 < iwinulose_> you can map anything wherever you want
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09:59 < iwinulose_> its by convention that we don't map addressable stuff
low in memory
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09:59 < aiju> iwinulose_: yeah, why did you ask me when you knew the answer?
;P
09:59 < Tonnerre> iwinulose_: I think in more recent versions Linux prevents
you from mapping stuff at 0
09:59 < Tonnerre> iwinulose_: but there were some exploits before they
forbid it
10:00 < iwinulose_> the point is null is different 0x0
10:00 < Tonnerre> forbade?
10:00 < Tonnerre> Whatever
10:00 < aiju> iwinulose_: not on x86
10:00 < iwinulose_> Tonnerre: most modern OSes do
10:00 < kfmfe04> I don't know about Go, but in my experience in C++, null
pointers are the least of my worries - they tend to be the easiest kinds of bugs
to trace and fix - I actually prefer that my app crap out...  (up to me to write
enough tests so they crap out during testing)
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10:01 < Tonnerre> kfmfe04: very much true
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10:01 < aiju> kfmfe04: yeah, that's the belssing of null pointer handling
10:01 < aiju> as i said, on VAX null pointers don't crap out
10:01 < aiju> you just get some bullshit number
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10:02 < aiju> probably for PDP-11 "compatibility"
10:02 < aiju> with 64 KB of virtual address space you can't afford wasting a
few bytes for that
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10:38 < jokoon> hello
10:38 < jessta> hello
10:38 < jessta> iwinulose: nonnil pointers impact the language causing all
kinds of required changes
10:39 < jokoon> I'm looking for anything related to 3D and go
10:39 < jessta> jokoon: https://github.com/banthar/Go-OpenGL
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10:45 < ijknacho> jokoon: also see: tinkercad.com
10:46 < jokoon> oO
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10:55 < aiju> tinkercad sounds like fun
10:55 < aiju> is it written in Go or why are you suggesting it?
10:55 < ijknacho> they use Go
10:56 < ijknacho> some devs are active on the golang-nuts group
10:57 < aiju> "webgl"
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11:28 < aiju> a program which requires a mouse wheel.
11:28 < aiju> great.
11:29 < mpl> aiju: serves you right for being a chording fan.  :P
11:29 < aiju> haha
11:29 < aiju> or rather, serves me right for buying a thinkapd
11:29 * mpl has both chording and a wheel on the evoluent ;)
11:30 < mpl> aiju: I use middle button + clit on the thinkpad as a wheel.  I
love it.
11:30 < aiju> that's what i hate about web apps
11:30 < aiju> they are always at least half broken
11:30 < mpl> s/web//
11:31 < mpl> aiju: quit whining and go listen some fine music from your
people.  like disco pogo.
11:31 < aiju> middle button + clit doesn't work :\
11:32 < mpl> hmm, which thinkpad?  mine is the T61.  you have have to enable
something.
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11:33 < mpl> I know I have to disable it if want to be able to chord 2+, but
I don't remember what it is that I have to disable exactly.
11:34 < mpl> aiju:
http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/How_to_configure_the_TrackPoint
11:34 < aiju> haha
11:34 < aiju> i broke the tool.
11:34 < mpl> that's what they call "vertical scrolling"
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14:18 < skelterjohn|work> morning all
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14:28 < ArgonneIntern> morning
14:29 < ArgonneIntern> yesterday a qeustion arose about how to deal with
http.HandlerFuncs only having 2 parameters passed, did anyone answer that
question?  And if so how did the person deal with it?
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14:37 < skelterjohn|work> closures
14:37 < zippoxer> []byte("some string") is converting to []byte in runtime
or compile time?
14:37 < skelterjohn|work> i don't know how the person *did* deal with it,
but closers are the way *to* deal with it
14:37 < aiju> zippoxer: should be compile time
14:37 < zippoxer> ok
14:37 < skelterjohn|work> "should be"?
14:37 < zippoxer> it's an optimization
14:37 < aiju> as in, i think it is
14:38 < skelterjohn|work> "could be", certainly
14:38 < aiju> zippoxer: use -S ..
14:38 < zippoxer> -S = optimization?
14:39 < aiju> no
14:39 < aiju> output assembly
14:39 < aiju> []byte("some string") creates a slice and copies "some string"
into it
14:40 < skelterjohn|work> sounds like that's during runtime, then
14:41 < zippoxer> maybe gccgo does some kind of optimization for such stuff?
14:41 < aiju> thinking about it, i have no clue how this should work on
compile time
14:41 < zippoxer> or will..
14:41 < aiju> zippoxer: why do you even care
14:41 < zippoxer> if I have thousands of those
14:41 < zippoxer> if I want to store data in go
14:41 < skelterjohn|work> don't over-optimize
14:41 < zippoxer> no sql or xml
14:42 < skelterjohn|work> this optimization would not help you in a
noticeable way
14:42 < aiju> there is no way this can be done at compile time
14:42 < aiju> so there is no optimization to be done here
14:43 < skelterjohn|work> you could write "some string" into wherever
constants are stored, and then make a byte slice that is backed by that data
14:43 < skelterjohn|work> by that array
14:43 < aiju> skelterjohn|work: no, you can't, then the semantics would be
wrong
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14:43 < zippoxer> I don't really care, just was interested about what's
optimization really is
14:43 < skelterjohn|work> in what way?
14:43 < zippoxer> just learned now :)
14:43 -!- dfr|mac [~dfr|work@ool-182e3fca.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #go-nuts
14:43 < aiju> all slices that way would point to the same data
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14:43 < aiju> ofc it depends what we're talking about
14:43 < aiju> i was thinking of
14:44 < aiju> func foo() []byte { return []byte("stuff") }
14:44 < skelterjohn|work> that would have to be on the heap, certainly
14:44 < aiju> a global variable is also stored on the heap
14:44 < skelterjohn|work> and if it's called multiple times
14:44 < aiju> ofc you could optimize that one
14:45 < skelterjohn|work> it would have to be a different "stuff" each time,
if the string literal actually backed it
14:45 < skelterjohn|work> since changing one shouldn't change the other
14:45 < aiju> but frankly, i don't see the point too much
14:45 < skelterjohn|work> i agree, i don't see a reasonable optimization
here
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14:45 < aiju> unless you have several megabytes of data stored that way
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15:02 < ptrb> Anyone know about a Zeroconf/Bonjour/etc.  implementation?
15:07 < Tv> ptrb: iirc there can be only one publisher on a host, you want
to talk to avahi or something for serving things; that's dbus
15:07 < Tv> and platform-dependent
15:08 < Tv> s/publisher/whatever the right term is for listening on the
zeroconf dns port/
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15:08 < Tv> client-side is not dependent on that, but the same dbus stuff
will help you with that too
15:08 < ptrb> huh, really.  is that a limitation at the protocol layer, or
HW/network stack layer?
15:09 < crazy2be> when do weekly releases come out?
15:09 < crazy2be> like, what day of the week?
15:09 < crazy2be> just wondering when I should be doing cd ~/go/src; hg
pull; hg update weekly
15:09 < crazy2be> (oh, and ./all.bash if there were changes)
15:11 < Tv> ptrb: i think that was a limitation of the way they decided to
use DNS
15:13 < skelterjohn|work> crazy2be, i don't think they actually come out
every week
15:13 < skelterjohn|work> it's announced on the mailing list
15:14 < Tv> ptrb: from avahi faq: "Is it OK to run multiple mDNS responders
on the same machine?
15:14 < Tv> No, it is not OK. Sooner or later some mDNS features known as
"Known Answer Suppression" and "Unicast Reply" (and probably some more) will
result in problems if more than one responder runs on the same machine."
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15:18 < ptrb> Tv: Alright, let me take a step back.  Maybe less Go-related,
but: what would be a good strategy for arbitrary peer discovery?  I can use a
custom port or whatever for my service.
15:19 < ptrb> I guess step 1 is learning more about multicast.
15:20 < zippoxer> for _, v in range map { v = "assign new value to the
pointer" }
15:20 < zippoxer> doesn't work
15:20 < Tv> ptrb: perhaps go zeromq lib will help
15:20 < ptrb> Tv: yeah, that's a good idea.
15:20 < skelterjohn|work> zippoxer: sure it does - it just don't do what you
think it should do
15:21 < ptrb> zippoxer: v is not reference, it's value (copy)
15:21 < zippoxer> ohh it copies the pointer v
15:21 < zippoxer> lol
15:21 < zippoxer> so map[k] will solve the problem (k = key)?
15:21 < ptrb> for k, v in range map { map[k] = "new thing" } -- yes
15:21 < zippoxer> ok thanks
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15:22 < Tv> ptrb: https://code.google.com/p/dbus-go/
15:22 < Tv> ptrb: if you're targeting linux, use that to talk to local
avahi, and you're all set
15:22 < ptrb> ptrb: eh, I'd rather not have process deps for what I'm doing.
15:22 < ptrb> err.
15:22 < ptrb> Tv: rather ;)
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15:33 < str1ngs> Tv: dbus-go is just a stub
15:33 < str1ngs> Tv: there is no code
15:33 < str1ngs>
https://code.google.com/p/dbus-go/source/browse/dbus/dbus.go
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15:38 < bartbes> that is awesome
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15:38 < skelterjohn|work> activity is low
15:38 < aiju> madness
15:39 < skelterjohn|work> one commit
15:39 < aiju> hahaha
15:39 < aiju> this is exactly how the perfect dbus package looks for me
15:39 < aiju> it supports all useful dbus features
15:40 < skelterjohn|work> aiju, what does your ideal programming/computing
environment look like?
15:40 < aiju> plan 9!
15:40 < aiju> not quite ideal
15:40 < taruti> 9front?  :D
15:40 < aiju> but the plumber beats the shit out of dbus
15:40 < aiju> taruti: ofc!
15:40 < aiju> but it's awkward to say 9front, because i contributed to it
15:41 < aiju> i have to fake modesty
15:41 < skelterjohn|work> what is 9front?
15:41 < aiju> http://code.google.com/p/plan9front/
15:41 < aiju> plan 9 fork
15:42 < skelterjohn|work> along with a request for bitcoins, heh
15:42 < aiju> we need hardware
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15:47 < zippoxer> can't I give a map to template.Execute?
15:47 < ArgonneIntern> ;
15:47 < skelterjohn|work> you can
15:47 < skelterjohn|work> pretty sure
15:47 < aiju> i agree with ArgonneIntern
15:48 < zippoxer> seems likes it takes only struct
15:48 < skelterjohn|work> it takes interface{}
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15:48 < skelterjohn|work> have you tried?
15:48 < zippoxer> yeah but when I give a map, there's a panic
15:48 < zippoxer> sec I'll try again
15:48 < aiju> have you tried rebooting?
15:48 < skelterjohn|work> what's the panic?
15:49 < zippoxer> sorry, I don't remember what was the panic (over 10
minutes ago) but it does accepts a map.
15:49 < photron> aiju: the correct phrase would have been: "have you tried
to turn it off and on again?" :)
15:50 < skelterjohn|work> zippoxer, so try again, tell me what the panic is
:)
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15:50 < zippoxer> in the last 10 minutes I changed the Makefiles so...  :P
15:50 < zippoxer> probably the problem was there
15:50 < skelterjohn|work> so i guess the point is moot
15:50 < skelterjohn|work> not sure why you asked at all!
15:50 < skelterjohn|work> since it's impossible to go back
15:51 < zippoxer> cause I thought it won't work, like it did before :P
15:51 < zippoxer> before 10 mins
15:52 * ww panics and flees
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16:14 < mattn_jp> ping adg
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16:39 <+iant> mattn_jp: adg is in Sydney and is most likely asleep
16:40 < mattn_jp> lol
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16:42 < mattn_jp> I wanted to discus about go's package dashboard.
16:42 < mattn_jp> currently, if the package is specified as sub-directory,
16:42 < mattn_jp> dashboard don't find name of package.
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16:47 < ancientlore> ls
16:47 < slang> Anyone know of a good way to pass the parameters of a
variadic function on to another variadic function?
16:47 < ancientlore> oops..  any windows go-nuts here?
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16:49 < slang> for example, I want to have a func foo(format string, args
...interface{}) that calls fmt.Fprintf(format, args)
16:49 < mattn_jp> fmt.Fprintf(format, args...)
16:49 < slang> ah
16:50 < slang> easy enough
16:50 < slang> mattn_jp: thanks!
16:51 < mattn_jp> Hmm, sorry I'm not native speaker.  I can't find
'variadic' in my englsih dictionary.
16:51 < mattn_jp> what is 'variadic'.
16:52 < pharris> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variadic
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16:54 < mattn_jp> hmm, understood.  thanks.  pharris
16:55 < mattn_jp> probably, it is variable + adicity(?) + ic
16:56 < pharris> Possibly variable + ic, with a random vowel thrown in
because variaic would be unpronounceable.
16:57 < pharris> Sorry, I don't know the etymology.
16:57 < mattn_jp> ok, i don't mind.  :)
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16:58 < pharris> (err..  random consonant.  Too many consecutive vowels)
17:04 < aiju> latin variare: to change
17:08 <+iant> which becomes English vary/variable/varying; I suspect
variadic is a backformation, because we can't say things like "variablous"
17:08 < skelterjohn|work> varytastic
17:08 < dlowe> haha.  but we should
17:08 < skelterjohn|work> variatasm
17:09 < skelterjohn|work> it's a variatasm function
17:09 < dlowe> There are varia suits
17:09 < aiju> also n-adic
17:10 < skelterjohn|work> i've heard of n-ary, but not n-adic
17:10 < dlowe> To understand English, you just need to learn bits of Latin,
Greek, French, and Anglo-saxon.  Easy!
17:10 < aiju> haha
17:10 < aiju> or just learn english
17:12 -!- dtjm [cebe4b09@gateway/web/freenode/ip.206.190.75.9] has joined #go-nuts
17:14 < dtjm> Can anyone help me with this code using http.Request:
https://gist.github.com/1043031 ? One of the headers is being sent empty and I
can't figure out why
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17:14 < dlowe> How then could you tell if homophilia was the love of the
same, or love of people?
17:14 < aiju> dlowe: pedophilia is worse
17:14 < aiju> lat.  pes, pedis means "foot"
17:14 < pjz> where's the right ppa to get go on my natty box?
17:15 < aiju> and german Pedophilie is foot fetish
17:15 < pjz> the top google hit is behind an openid login?  very odd
17:15 < dlowe> aiju: haha
17:15 < skelterjohn|work> i sometimes wish i could define namespaces within
packages
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17:24 < ancientlore> dtjm if I read your code right, you're trying to get
the Date header inside of requestSignature before you set it in TestHMAC
17:25 < dtjm> I'm trying to send both a Date header and X-Request-Signature
in the request
17:25 < dtjm> I see both headers on the other end, but the
X-Request-Signature value is empty
17:25 < mattn_jp> hmm, just uploaded application to go appengine.  :)
17:26 < ebering> is there a nice way to write integer max
17:26 < aiju> yes
17:26 < aiju> ~0
17:26 < aiju> unsigned integer, though
17:26 < skelterjohn|work> or int32, 2<<31-1
17:27 < ebering> by nice I mean clear from inspection when in a drunken haze
17:27 < dtjm> I think there is something wrong with how I am generating that
requestSignature
17:27 < skelterjohn|work> uint32, 2<<32-1
17:27 < ebering> rather
17:27 < aiju> skelterjohn|work: you mean "1<<31"
17:27 < skelterjohn|work> yes
17:27 < ebering> I want the maximum of two integers
17:27 < skelterjohn|work> thanks
17:27 < ebering> not MaxInt
17:27 < aiju> ebering: ah
17:27 < skelterjohn|work> oh
17:27 < ebering> that is a constant in math
17:27 < aiju> isn't there a Max function in some package?
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17:27 < skelterjohn|work> you mean a built-in that if given two constants,
evaluates to the max of them?
17:27 < ebering> aiju: if there is it isn't in the math function
17:27 < ebering> skelterjohn|work: doesn't have to be that fancy
17:28 < skelterjohn|work> then what do you mean "is a constant"
17:28 < skelterjohn|work> oh sorry
17:28 < skelterjohn|work> i misread
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17:28 < skelterjohn|work> func(x, y T) T { if x > y { return x } return y
}
17:29 < ebering> ^ should really be in math
17:29 < ebering> so that everyone's code isn't littered with it
17:29 < skelterjohn|work> there would have to be one for each numeric type
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17:30 < ebering> better than one for every program that needs Max
17:30 < ebering> (imo)
17:30 < skelterjohn|work> we should add C macros to go :)
17:31 < aiju> we should remove C macros from C
17:31 < aiju> they are only abused
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17:33 < ancientlore> dtjm have you tested that there's a value before you
set the header?  You can simplify your bse64 code too: dst := make([]byte,
base64.StdEncoding.EncodedLen(len(b))) base64.StdEncoding.Encode(dst, b) return
string(dst)
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17:36 < dtjm> ancientlore yes in fact I can get the value out of
http.Request.Header.Get after I Set it (thanks for your help btw)
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17:38 < dtjm> ancientlore it works now!
17:38 < dtjm> I think something was wonky with my base64 function
17:39 < ancientlore> good deal
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17:41 < dtjm> thank you very much ancientlore
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18:48 < skelterjohn|work> any geometers / graph theoreticians around?  i
have two collections of shapes, and i want to check how well they match each
other.  i want to quickly mark each shape in both collections as matching a shape
in the other collection or not
18:49 < skelterjohn|work> one way might be to first try to find a point in
each collection that can represent the "center" of that collection, and see what
overlaps happen when i align both to that center
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19:03 < KirkMcDonald> Are they convex?
19:03 < skelterjohn|work> no - but how would that make a difference?
19:03 < KirkMcDonald> I'm not a geometer.  I'm just thinking idly.
19:03 < skelterjohn|work> i can check if two individual shapes match by just
going vertex by vertex
19:04 < skelterjohn|work> writing up a routine to do just that, and report
the amount the match is off
19:04 < KirkMcDonald> My notion was to overlay the centers of their bounding
boxes on each other, "subtract" one shape from the other, and calculate the area
of the result.
19:04 < KirkMcDonald> Or, not subtract.
19:04 < KirkMcDonald> XOR, as it were.
19:04 < skelterjohn|work> i understand
19:06 < skelterjohn|work> (a-b) + (b-a) seems like it should be zero
19:06 < skelterjohn|work> but not in this case
19:06 < skelterjohn|work> the big problem i'm running into is not deciding
it two shapes can match, but deciding which two shapes to test for matching
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19:19 < kfmfe04> algorithmically, to cut down on the number of combinations,
could you hash by number of vertices and just compare the subset with the same
number of vertices?
19:20 < kfmfe04> ie in order to ignore all combinations with different
numbers of vertices - you still have to do some more checks
19:20 < kfmfe04> alternatively, if you could hash/checksum your shape, that
would be even more efficient
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19:27 < skelterjohn|work> not sure how i could do that - small variations
are allowed
19:27 < zippoxer> how to "pause" a go application?  for {} uses a nice
amount of cpu and sleep is not fantastic too.
19:27 < skelterjohn|work> an "almost square" is almost a square, and would
match with some error
19:27 < skelterjohn|work> zippoxer: select {}
19:28 < zippoxer> similar to wait for a channel input?
19:28 < zippoxer> (doesn't take 99% cpu?)
19:28 < skelterjohn|work> it takes zero cpu
19:28 < zippoxer> okay thanks :)
19:33 < kfmfe04> what is the algorithmic distinction between "almost" and
"not close at all"?
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19:34 < kfmfe04> you need to define that precisely before you proceed
19:34 < skelterjohn|work> none - but i have a metric
19:34 < skelterjohn|work> rather, i'm trying to figure out a metric based on
how much the vertices would need to change in order to be a perfect match
19:34 < kfmfe04> so, you are simply trying to optimize by ignoring the ones
which fall outside of a certain number on your metric?
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19:35 < kfmfe04> I mean, it's an issue of optimization, correct?  if you
don't care about speed, you are done?
19:36 < skelterjohn|work> yes
19:36 < kfmfe04> so it's a matter of chucking the pairs that are "not close
at all" - hmm...
19:36 < skelterjohn|work> i feel like it will be similar to graph
isomorphism, but easier since the shapes/vertices have locations
19:36 < ArgonneIntern> today is a glorious day.  Got an end to end working
test today on the project we've been working on, and our main daemon is being
switched to go code :) after that it will be entirely in go
19:36 < skelterjohn|work> not just that - one shape in collection 1 could
match 2 shapes in collection 2
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19:37 < skelterjohn|work> but maybe only one of those matches allows for the
overall fit
19:37 < kfmfe04> ultimately, you only care about the one that is best fit?
19:37 < skelterjohn|work> been pretty glorious for me, too - i have beaten
my brother in table tennis for perhaps the 30th time in a row
19:37 < ArgonneIntern> rofl
19:38 < skelterjohn|work> kfmfe04: not exactly - i care about which pieces
aren't matching in that best fit
19:39 < skelterjohn|work> hmm, is there any service that is like pastebin,
but allows you to quickly sketch something?  :)
19:39 < aiju> if there is it
19:39 < aiju> it is full of penises
19:39 < kfmfe04> let me transform your problem into something else easier to
think about
19:40 < skelterjohn|work> rofl
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19:40 < kfmfe04> suppose instead of best fit - think about matching two
objects with "similar colors"
19:40 < kfmfe04> that's actually much easier because you could hash on some
digitized combination of rgb (perhaps only on 8bits instead of 24)
19:41 < kfmfe04> you could quickly generate lists of objects with similar
colors
19:41 < kfmfe04> you could do something like this for your shapes - I just
don't know enough details about what you are trying to do to give suggestions -
sry
19:43 < kfmfe04> there must be some characteristics of for your shapes that
make them potentially similar (or dissimilar) - I would attempt to hash on those
characteristics (eg # of vertices, area, position - I don't know)
19:44 < skelterjohn|work> think of two army bases.  they both have roads and
buildings.  you want to see what roads and buildings they both have in common,
allowing small variations but not big ones
19:45 < kfmfe04> sounds like a good candidate for SVM
19:45 < kfmfe04> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Support_vector_machines
19:46 < skelterjohn|work> !
19:46 < skelterjohn|work> i'm not sure SVMs map to this problem
19:47 < kfmfe04> I'm almost out of ideas, then - SVMs are good for
categorization or grouping based on some metric...
19:48 < kfmfe04> it's statistically-based fuzzy logic
19:48 < skelterjohn|work> SVMs are good for taking a bunch of examples and
finding lines to separate classes
19:48 < skelterjohn|work> i've just got two things to compare
19:48 < skelterjohn|work> and when i said lines, i really meant not-lines.
19:49 < kfmfe04> you already have the algorithm for comparing two things to
compare, right?  you're looking for something to tell you which pairs to ignore?
19:50 < skelterjohn|work> i can check get some representation of the
"difference" between two shapes.  i want to use that as a routine for lining up
two larger sets of shapes
19:50 < skelterjohn|work> once it's lined up, then i can see which shapes
don't have a corresponding shape in the other collection
19:51 < kfmfe04> if A is similar to B and B is similar to C, is A similar to
C?
19:51 < kfmfe04> under your metric?  or not necessarily?
19:51 < skelterjohn|work> (makes sketch)
19:51 < skelterjohn|work> sudo apt-get install gimp
19:51 < skelterjohn|work> :\
19:51 < skelterjohn|work> heh
19:52 < kfmfe04> got gimp - post you pic
19:52 < kfmfe04> your
19:52 < skelterjohn|work> i meant i was installing it, so i could make a
sketch
19:52 < skelterjohn|work> just a min
19:52 < kfmfe04> hahah - k
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19:58 < skelterjohn|work> http://paul.rutgers.edu/~jasmuth/matching.png
19:58 < skelterjohn|work> there are two collections, one on the top left,
one on the top right
19:59 < skelterjohn|work> since i'm human, i can see how to best overlay
them, and i colored them in red/blue to show which came from where
19:59 < kfmfe04> k
19:59 < skelterjohn|work> a blue shape or a red shape without a twin is
marked
20:00 < kfmfe04> you are trying to detect those 3 rectangles that
approximately overlap?
20:01 < skelterjohn|work> yeah - i need to find the way to line up both
collections such that as many shapes as possible overlap
20:01 < kfmfe04> k - got it - thinking
20:01 < skelterjohn|work> or more concretely, such that the shapes i say
overlap have the smallest total error, according to my metric
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20:02 < kfmfe04> so, totally ignoring efficiency, if you could position all
the possible positions for A vs all possible positions for B, you take the one
with the smallest total error, correct?
20:02 < skelterjohn|work> to brute force it, i could try all pairs of one
object from the left, one from the right, and see if lining them up makes
everything else line up too
20:02 < skelterjohn|work> yes
20:02 < kfmfe04> ic
20:03 < kfmfe04> and all your objects are in the form of vertices (not
bitmaps)?
20:03 < skelterjohn|work> not sure about the best way to penalize shapes
without a twin
20:03 < skelterjohn|work> yes
20:03 < skelterjohn|work> and they will match up exactly, for the most part
20:03 < ArgonneIntern> when you define a channel as var heckleToAllocateChan
chan listmsg for instance, do you have to make it before you can use it?
20:03 < kfmfe04> interesting problem
20:03 < skelterjohn|work> ArgonneIntern: you always have to make a chan
20:04 < ArgonneIntern> grr
20:04 < skelterjohn|work> the zero-value for a channel cannot be used
20:04 < skelterjohn|work> kfmfe04: added difficulty - this will be done in
the inner loop of a larger process, so it really needs to be as fast as i can make
it :)
20:04 < photron> skelterjohn|work: your looking for image registration, but
applied to groups of shapes instead of images
20:05 < skelterjohn|work> photron: yes - and i figured that because it's
distinct shapes i might be able to do something better than the image reg
techniques would suggest
20:05 < skelterjohn|work> it feels like a graph isomorphism problem, kinda
20:05 < skelterjohn|work> except there are no edges
20:06 < kfmfe04> but you don't have to worry about scaling larger and
smaller, right?
20:06 < skelterjohn|work> nope
20:06 < skelterjohn|work> only transformation is translation
20:06 < skelterjohn|work> if it makes a difference, these shapes are the
components of an integrated circuit when scanned with an electron microscope
20:07 < skelterjohn|work> and i'm looking for patterns
20:07 < kfmfe04> makes sense
20:07 < skelterjohn|work> and all the code is go
20:07 < skelterjohn|work> bien sur
20:09 < kfmfe04> there has to be some kind of pattern recognition algorithm
that handles this kind of thing, close to out of the box - hmm...
20:09 < skelterjohn|work> i bet there is - i was hoping someone here would
know it or we could reinvent it
20:10 < skelterjohn|work> a first try might be to choose shapes from each
collection that have the minimum coordinates - ie are on the bottom left
20:11 < kfmfe04> actually you already have the two images, right?  you just
want to find their positions such that the error is minimal?
20:11 < skelterjohn|work> line up those two shapes and see how everything
else does
20:11 < skelterjohn|work> i've got two collections of polygons, and they
have absolute positions
20:12 < crunge> skelterjohn|work: do you expect that in some orientation
they'll be very similar?
20:12 < skelterjohn|work> if you're talking about rotation, no rotation is
allowed
20:12 < skelterjohn|work> but yes
20:12 < skelterjohn|work> or rather, if they are i want to know
20:12 < skelterjohn|work> you can think of it as the fitness function for a
hill-climbing algorithm
20:13 < kfmfe04> yup - that's what I was thinking
20:13 < kfmfe04> but can you get stuck in a local minima/maxima?
20:13 < crunge> I'm fairly CS dumb, but the enblend tool comes to mind for a
similar problem with rasters
20:13 < skelterjohn|work> yes - that is taken care of by statistics math
20:13 < kfmfe04> jiggle it, if need be
20:13 < skelterjohn|work> i'm doing MCMC
20:13 < skelterjohn|work> "jiggle it" <- the gist of MCMC
20:14 < kfmfe04> it sounds like you have something that works already!  have
profiling shown it to be slow?
20:14 < skelterjohn|work> i haven't coded it - i was just thinking out loud
20:15 < crunge> NM, enblend assumes you already have everything lined up, it
just smoothed the edges.
20:15 < skelterjohn|work> i wrote the similarity function that takes two
shapes, returns the total amount that vertices would have to move to make it match
20:15 < skelterjohn|work> that's it
20:15 < kfmfe04> I think what you have should work fine - I would just worry
about false positives in case of circuit matching, but maybe this isn't an issue,
if your boxes actually contain more circuit detail
20:16 < skelterjohn|work> i like to let a solution steep for a little while
before i try to put it to practice
20:16 < skelterjohn|work> the boxes are the lowest level item i've got -
it's a big vector image
20:16 < skelterjohn|work> they represent individual transitors, pathways
between them
20:17 < kfmfe04> then if you have enough boxes, you don't need to worry
about false positives
20:18 < skelterjohn|work> i don't follow
20:18 < skelterjohn|work> oh - i am not comparing two whole ICs together
20:18 < skelterjohn|work> i am comparing small pieces of one IC with each
other
20:19 < skelterjohn|work> to find patterns within that circuit
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20:19 < skelterjohn|work> so i have two major problems: 1) group shapes
together into components
20:19 < kfmfe04> groups of circuits that may represent a receiver or an
amplifier, etc..., right?
20:19 < skelterjohn|work> 2) group components together (based on what we're
talking about) into clusters
20:20 < skelterjohn|work> more like, a group of these shapes might represent
a multi-bit "and"
20:20 < skelterjohn|work> i don't know what a receiver or an amplifier is,
in this context
20:20 < skelterjohn|work> i don't know anything about circuit design
20:20 < kfmfe04> aye - so, is it possible for you to pattern recognize a
group of components to be X and it's really Y?
20:21 < skelterjohn|work> i don't give the group a label - i just want to
know that they're all in the same group
20:21 < kfmfe04> ok - then it doesn't sound like it's a problem in your case
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20:22 < kfmfe04> if your code is modular enough, you should be able to plop
in various algorithms to test
20:22 < skelterjohn|work> certainly
20:22 < kfmfe04> the hard part would be coming up with good/appropriate test
cases (the sweat work)
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20:25 < ArgonneIntern> how do you select on a channel
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20:26 < skelterjohn|work> it's in the spec
20:26 < ArgonneIntern> yes I know, it's confusing
20:26 < skelterjohn|work> and "effective go"
20:26 < ArgonneIntern> so would it be select { i := <-channel }
20:26 < chomp> it's pretty simple
20:26 < skelterjohn|work> that's it
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20:26 < chomp> you need a case
20:26 < skelterjohn|work> oh right
20:27 < chomp> http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html#Select_statements
20:27 < chomp> pretty clear there
20:27 < skelterjohn|work>
http://golang.org/doc/effective_go.html#leaky_buffer
20:27 < skelterjohn|work> example provided in the effective go page
20:27 < skelterjohn|work> oh, the spec has a pretty good set too
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20:28 < skelterjohn|work> heh, i like the select-based random number
generator
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20:33 < ArgonneIntern> so in that select statements website, case i3, ok :=
<-channel
20:33 < ArgonneIntern> there is an else saying the channel is not open
20:33 < ArgonneIntern> if select is blocking wouldn't that elese never
happen
20:34 < skelterjohn|work> if someone closes the channel, <-c3 will fire
20:34 < skelterjohn|work> except it will give false to ok
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20:38 < ArgonneIntern> yes boss ust talked to me
20:38 < ArgonneIntern> so if you select on the multi return it will never
block right
20:38 < ArgonneIntern> because it will always return true or false for ok
20:39 < ArgonneIntern> but it will block on the single return i =
<-channel?
20:39 < skelterjohn|work> no
20:39 < skelterjohn|work> x, ok = <- ch blocks
20:39 < skelterjohn|work> ok just tells you if the channel was closed or not
20:39 < ArgonneIntern> yea see and you guys said, "just go look at the spec"
20:39 < ArgonneIntern> it is confusing
20:39 < skelterjohn|work> it's all in the spec
20:40 < ArgonneIntern> but if you select on that statement how can it block
20:40 < skelterjohn|work>
http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html#Receive_operator
20:40 < ArgonneIntern> ok is always true or false
20:41 < skelterjohn|work> you don't enter that case unless something is sent
on the channel or the channel closes
20:41 < ArgonneIntern> i thought ok was for if there was anything on the
channel
20:41 < ArgonneIntern> not if the channel was opened or closed
20:42 < skelterjohn|work> nope
20:42 < skelterjohn|work> it's for if it is open or closed
20:42 < ArgonneIntern> until the channel is closed
20:42 < skelterjohn|work> you can use select to do a non-blocking read by
having a default: case
20:42 < ArgonneIntern> so when I do for i, ok := <-channel ; ok ; {
20:42 < ArgonneIntern> it loops forever
20:43 < skelterjohn|work> only because the iterative clause of your for is
empty
20:43 < ArgonneIntern> ok so I meant for i, ok := <-channel ; ok ; i, ok
= <- channel {
20:43 < skelterjohn|work> but if you do something like "for { i, ok := <-
channel; if !ok { break } }"
20:44 < skelterjohn|work> that will loop once for each value sent on the
chan.  once the channel is closed, it will break
20:44 < ArgonneIntern> what if there is no value on the channel but it's
open
20:44 < skelterjohn|work> then it will block
20:44 < ArgonneIntern> even the for loop will block?
20:44 < skelterjohn|work> the receive statement will block
20:44 < ArgonneIntern> ohh
20:45 < skelterjohn|work> so yes, the for loop that uses that receive will
block
20:45 < ArgonneIntern> so I don't even need a select lol
20:45 < skelterjohn|work> i don't know what you're trying to do, so that's
tough for me to say
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20:45 < ArgonneIntern> basically I don't know go
20:45 < crunge> ArgonneIntern: you just want to receive data on a single
channel and process it as it's received, correct?
20:45 < ArgonneIntern> but you already knew that
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20:45 < ArgonneIntern> yes
20:45 < skelterjohn|work> then you should use range
20:46 < skelterjohn|work> for i := range ch { ...  }
20:46 < ArgonneIntern> the channels close when the daemon ends, which
hopefully will be never
20:46 < skelterjohn|work> that will keep receiving from ch until it is
closed
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20:49 < ArgonneIntern> what about on the opposing end
20:49 < ArgonneIntern> if you wanted to read until there is nothing left to
read
20:49 < ArgonneIntern> but keep the channel open
20:50 < skelterjohn|work> don't follow
20:50 < ArgonneIntern> so you shove stuff in one end and read it from
another, on the tail end you are in an infinateloop that reads everything in the
channel and when nothing else is on the channel you operate on the data
20:51 < skelterjohn|work> you could put that in the default: clause of a
select
20:51 < skelterjohn|work> default will fire if the other channels have no
data ready
20:52 < crunge> ArgonneIntern: what is the program supposed to do?
20:52 < crunge> if you're trying to send a batch of work, perhaps you want
to send a channel down the channel
20:52 < ArgonneIntern> http://www.pastie.org/2113017
20:53 < ArgonneIntern> that is a go routine
20:53 < chomp> you can also write 10e9 btw :)
20:53 < ArgonneIntern> and you can see I clearly don't understand channels
as well as I thought I did lol
20:55 < chomp> if you want to iterate on receives from a channel use range
20:55 < ArgonneIntern> that is supposed to get new polling addresses, get
status on them, and remove any addresses that don't need to be polled, every 10
seconds
20:55 < ArgonneIntern> yes but range blocks
20:55 < ArgonneIntern> skelterjohn|work: said
20:55 < chomp> what's wrong with blocking
20:55 < chomp> use a goroutine
20:55 < skelterjohn|work> what do you want to do when there is nothing on
the chan?
20:55 < ArgonneIntern> well the first channel for is a infinite loop lol
20:55 < ArgonneIntern> get out of the for loop
20:56 < chomp> goroutines
20:56 < ArgonneIntern> I just want to grab whats there and get out
20:56 < chomp> are for this.
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22:47 < dgrijalva> good afternoon folks.
22:47 < dgrijalva> I'm having a problem with 6prof on OS X
22:47 < dgrijalva> every time i attach 6prof to my app, my app crashes
somewhere deep in the bowels of the runtime
22:47 < dgrijalva> anybody else see this?
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--- Log closed Fri Jun 24 00:00:54 2011