--- Log opened Mon Aug 22 00:00:20 2011
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01:34 < kuroneko> adg: heard you were stirring up the locals at pyconau.  :)
01:36 < f2f> video or it didn't happen.
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01:39 < kuroneko> f2f: when I find some myself - I'd like to see evidence
too ;)
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01:47 < f2f> so, what happened?
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02:01 < kuroneko> f2f: search twitter for @enneff + #pyconau.  >_>
02:01 * kuroneko is currently swearing at the json module.
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02:07 * kuroneko kicks json.indirect
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02:15 < f2f> http://nf.id.au/pyconau-golang-and-a-bit-of-lesprit-de-lescal
02:15 < kuroneko> yup
02:15 < kuroneko> found that too :)
02:16 < kuroneko> is anybody going to be horribly upset if I hack the json
module to support unmarshalling to non-pointers?
02:17 < kuroneko> because the fact it can't unmarshal to struct members with
custom types is pretty damned annoying.
02:22 < f2f> kuroneko, di you find the slides of adg's alk?
02:22 < f2f> talk even
02:22 < kuroneko> nup
02:23 < f2f> http://t.co/BVzergF
02:23 < vsmatck> Seems like there should be a idiom for that.  Like try to
cast to interface with "func Umarshal([]byte)" or something.
02:23 < kuroneko> vsmatck: yeah, I'm fixing the literal code to handle it
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02:24 < kuroneko> it doesn't try the obvious approach of checking the value
to see if it implements Unmarshaller before using the indirect type unmarshalling
stuff
02:25 < kuroneko> kinda sucks though
02:25 < kuroneko> I'll have to provide a patch against golang with Orchestra
until the fix goes upstream.
02:25 < vsmatck> I suppose the interface could be at any level of
indirection.  I wonder if there are performance concerns here.
02:26 < kuroneko> that's what the indirect stuff does
02:26 < kuroneko> it searches down through that but assumes that there is
>=1 level of indirection
02:26 < vsmatck> Ah. I haven't looked in to it too much.
02:26 < kuroneko> whereas in thise case, there is no indirection
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02:30 < kuroneko> hm.  it didn't break the existing tests.
02:31 < vsmatck> I think it's cool you're hacking on the standard library.
I tend to go off in my own world.  It's admirable to aim to do something a lot of
people will benefit from.
02:31 < kuroneko> there was an earth shattering kaboom.  >_>
Fortunately, in my code.
02:32 < kuroneko> vsmatck: I kinda hate having to do it to be honest -
mostly because I only hack on the standard packages if there's a misfeature or bug
that's making my life hell
02:32 < kuroneko> last time it was cgo
02:32 < kuroneko> back when cgo had problems with opaque types
02:36 < kuroneko> the problem is then my code ends up depending on the
bugfix
02:36 < kuroneko> and the golang release cycle is kinda slow
02:36 * vsmatck doesn't understand.  He is a debian user.
02:36 < chilts> there is a weekly and generally bi-monthy release - doesn't
seem that slow
02:37 < kuroneko> the bimonthly is the issue
02:37 < kuroneko> that's what I use for my development work
02:37 < chilts> if that's too long, use the weekly?
02:37 < chilts> and if that's too long, run off head :)
02:37 < kuroneko> hard to release stable software that needs a specific
version of the weekly
02:38 < kuroneko> http://github.com/anchor/Orchestra is my current project
02:38 < kuroneko> which has to track a 'stable' release.
02:38 < chilts> sounds like the bimonthly is what you need then
02:38 < kuroneko> yup
02:38 < kuroneko> problem is I've just bugfixed the json package in it, so
it'll be another month before that goes mainline and I can rip the bugfix out of
my repo.
02:38 < kuroneko> unless they do a point release just for my bugfix
02:38 < kuroneko> which is hardly lightly
02:38 < kuroneko> err, likely
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02:45 < kuroneko> http://code.google.com/p/go/issues/detail?id=2170
02:45 <@adg> kuroneko: :)
02:45 < kuroneko> adg: I plan to come to your (and Rob's) talk tomorrow
night
02:46 <@adg> it's next tuesday, not tomorrow
02:46 < kuroneko> eh?  have I got my weeks screwed up again?
02:46 < kuroneko> yup!  I do!
02:47 < chilts> adg: 16 people have now joined the GoLangNZ group (including
a couple in Auckland, some from Vic uni and a few from Weta Digital) :)
02:47 <@adg> phew
02:47 <@adg> chilts: nice
02:47 < chilts> :)
02:47 < kuroneko> adg: although I didn't put it into my calendar either, so
that'd be why :)
02:47 * kuroneko fixes
02:49 < kuroneko> adg: who do I have to bribe to get that featurefix pushed
into r59?  ;)
02:49 <@adg> kuroneko: unlikely.  what's the fix?
02:49 < kuroneko> let the json package unmarshal immediate values of custom
types in structs
02:49 < kuroneko> rather than pointers only
02:50 <@adg> i'm not sure i understand
02:50 <@adg> example?
02:50 < kuroneko> if you have type ...  struct { MyField FooType }
02:50 < kuroneko> and FooType is an Unmarshaller, json can't unmarshal into
MyField correctly
02:51 < kuroneko> if it's *FooType it will
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02:51 < kuroneko> it's missing a check against the struct member to see if
it directly implements Unmarshaller
02:51 < kuroneko> the link above is the bug report + patch.
02:52 <@adg> is the fix in the weekly?
02:52 <@adg> or not fixed yet?
02:52 < kuroneko> not fixed yet, I only submitted it
02:52 <@adg> i see, it isn't
02:52 < kuroneko> since I only just ran headlong into it
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03:03 <@adg> taking a look
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03:03 <@adg> doubt it'll go into r59.1, or that there'll be a r59.1
03:03 <@adg> maybe
03:05 < kuroneko> when is r60 due?
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03:07 <@adg> some time in the next 6 weeks
03:07 <@adg> we release every 1-2 months
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03:08 < jmhodges> hey, i'm confused.  json.Indent returns an os.Error, but
I'd like the Offset field in the json.SyntaxError that it's actually returning
03:09 < jmhodges> however, i can't get the type assertion to compile because
json.SyntaxError has a String() method on it
03:09 < jmhodges> what's the right way to do this these days?
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03:11 < kuroneko> jerr, ok := err.(*json.SyntaxError)
03:11 < kuroneko> if ok { jerr.Offset ....  }
03:11 < jmhodges> kuroneko: but it's returning os.Error, not *os.Error
03:11 < kuroneko> no, os.Error is an interface
03:11 < jmhodges> ah ha
03:11 < kuroneko> it could be implemented by a pointer to something
03:11 < jmhodges> so then the real bug is that it's not setting Offset to
anything other than zero
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03:12 < jmhodges> naturally
03:12 < jmhodges> i'll write up a bug report.  thank you.
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03:17 < jrabbit> Does any one know if apple has accepted a go app into the
mac app store?
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03:55 <@adg> jrabbit: i haven't heard anything about that
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05:05 < kuroneko> yay!  r's looked at the bug.
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05:50 < jmhodges> kuroneko: btw, i got the fix to Offset done
http://code.google.com/p/go/source/detail?r=d0f1060daf9c
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05:52 < kuroneko> cool.
05:52 < kuroneko> My patch has indeed fixed my problems with the json module
- so I just pushed the first half of this update to Orchestra to the public repo
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05:55 < jmhodges> kuroneko: ohh, which patch?
05:56 < kuroneko> Bug 2170
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05:56 < jmhodges> ahh word
05:56 < kuroneko> Rob's debating that it's not necessarily correct because
of how it alters the receiver, so is deferring final word to rsc.
05:57 < kuroneko> if rsc says it's no good, I'll just have to change my
code, which I'm not really keen on.
05:57 * jmhodges nods
05:59 < kuroneko> the main place I'm using it can be seen in
https://github.com/anchor/Orchestra/blob/master/src/conductor/job_request.go
05:59 < kuroneko> where Scope and State are actually type'd ints so I can
make the marshaller do my bidding.  :)
06:00 < jmhodges> ah
06:00 < kuroneko> having to change all instances of req.State to *req.State
will kinda suck ;)
06:02 < f2f> couldn't you do it with gofmt?
06:03 < kuroneko> no idea.  maybe.
06:05 < f2f> gofmt -r 'req.State -> *req.State' -l *.go
06:05 < f2f> no idea if it'll work
06:06 < kuroneko> they're not universally req.State, Ineed to see how those
rule swork
06:06 < f2f> but it looks like a thing that should
06:07 < f2f> well, if you do all the function definitions and type casts
with gofmt then you're guaranteed that the type system will catch the rest
06:07 < f2f> i hope.  i haven't written anything as big as your system in go
:)
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06:10 < kuroneko> it'll get close
06:10 < kuroneko> gofmt hates my style though :)
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06:58 < kuroneko> there, patch for 2170 fixed to actually be useful now.
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08:41 < moraes> go'od morning.
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08:47 < uriel> good morning kuroneko
08:47 < uriel> er, good morning moraes
08:47 < uriel> my brain clearly is not awake yet, I can't even blame this
one on tab completion :)
08:52 < moraes> haha
08:53 < ww> is it a good morning?  yes it is!
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10:27 < moraes> i asked this before and thought i'd know how to do it.
10:27 < moraes> so:
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/7145905/fmt-sprintf-passing-an-array-of-arguments
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10:32 < Sh4rK> hi
10:32 < uriel> moraes: I think what you want is foo[:]
10:33 < Sh4rK> how fast is it to use interface{} types in function arguments
to mimic overloads?
10:33 < Sh4rK> or how slow
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10:33 < uriel> Sh4rK: fast enough, but still usually a bad idea
10:33 < uriel> just write different functions
10:34 < moraes> uriel, aw that worked.
10:34 < Sh4rK> why bad idea?
10:34 < moraes> thanks.
10:35 < str1ngs> moraes: hmm you sure that worked?
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10:36 < moraes> str1ngs, no.
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10:36 * uriel wasn't sure what moraes wanted...
10:37 < moraes> isn't clear by the question?
10:37 < uriel> Sh4rK: confusing, different functions with different
arguments should have different names
10:37 < uriel> moraes: I'm still no really awake (as usual)
10:38 < moraes> i have an array with 3 strings.  i want to format a string
"%s%s%s" using that array.
10:38 < Sh4rK> uriel: it works in other languages, so why not in go?
10:38 < uriel> Sh4rK: because Go is not other langugaes (thank God)
10:38 < Sh4rK> yeah, but this can be useful
10:38 < moraes> Sh4rK, it works, it is just generally bad design.
10:39 < moraes> polymorphic functions are generally bad design.
10:39 * uriel is always puzzeled by people asking "why Go dosn't do this and that
like every othe language?" what would be the point of a new language that did
things the same way as existing languages (which obviously suck)
10:40 < moraes> ok, another question.
10:40 < moraes> why go isn't awesome like every other language?
10:40 < uriel> hahaha
10:40 < Sh4rK> lol
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10:40 < Sh4rK> currently Go is my favorite language
10:41 < Sh4rK> so I didn't say it should be like other languages
10:41 < uriel> actually that is a sad thing about many modern languages,
they seem like different 'skins' for the same thing, different flavours of sugar,
but the same concepts more or less
10:41 < Sh4rK> but to have some feature that isn't there
10:41 < uriel> (.NET is the ultimate representation of this, where you have
many languages, but they are all basically different syntax for C#)
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10:42 < moraes> mine too, after haskell and erlang.
10:42 < moraes> kidding, i know nothing about haskell or erlang.
10:42 < Sh4rK> lol
10:42 < exch> more accurately, they are all different representations of
ILasm.  Then again, any language is really a different representation of old
fashioned assembly oreven raw binary :p
10:43 < zozoR> i only wish i could cross compile to windows with cgo :(
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10:52 < jnwhiteh> I'm not sure if there's an easy way to do that, because
with vararg you'll always end up with a slice
10:53 < jnwhiteh> (ignore me, window was scrolled up)
10:53 < moraes> str1ngs, you know how?
10:54 < moraes> jnwhiteh, you refer to my question?
10:54 < jnwhiteh> yes, I do
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10:54 < moraes> ok, thinking on an alternative.
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10:55 < jnwhiteh> its odd though, since the fmt package uses slices
internally
10:55 < jnwhiteh> (because of the vararg)
10:55 < uriel> ah, hmm..  maybe it needs to be a slice of interface{}?
10:55 < jnwhiteh> they could easily expose an function that takes in
[]interface{}
10:56 < uriel> jnwhiteh: then why wouldn't ...  work?
10:56 < jnwhiteh> I think it does
10:56 < jnwhiteh> moment =)
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10:56 < str1ngs> moraes: not pretty
https://gist.github.com/32f45b9acee82f901c87
10:56 < jnwhiteh> yeah it works fine
10:57 < jnwhiteh> foo := []interface{}{"foo", "bar", "baz"};
fmt.Printf("%s%s%s", foo...)
10:57 < jnwhiteh> does just what you want it to do
10:57 < moraes> ah
10:57 < moraes> i can have a []interface{} instead
10:57 < jnwhiteh> indeed, you need to
10:58 < jnwhiteh> because it can contain anything =)
10:58 < moraes> instead of setting a []string will do that
10:58 < moraes> thanks sir
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10:58 < str1ngs> moraes: see my example though if you are working with
[]string
10:59 < moraes> got the idea.  thanks.
10:59 < str1ngs> and you dont need string(v)
10:59 < str1ngs> v should be fine.  left over from testing
11:00 < moraes> aha!  PASS
11:01 < moraes> tests passed now.
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12:19 < kuroneko> Hey Uriel
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12:46 < hokapoka> I've forgotten if it's possible to declare in a struct the
direction of a chan.  And the syntax for declaring the direction within params of
a function.
12:48 < hokapoka> Or am I imagining the fact it's possible?
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12:48 < hokapoka> func foo( in <-chan string, out ->chan string)
(*Bar){
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12:51 < hokapoka> aha!  type foo struct { in <-chan string; out chan<-
string }
12:52 < hokapoka> I am correct in thinking that this markup denotes that the
type foo can only read from In and Send to Out?
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12:59 < knowmercy> morning
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12:59 < knowmercy> anyone ever build a media server with upnp with go?
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13:00 < kuroneko> wayneeseguin: hmm.  you look familiar...  :)
13:01 < kuroneko> something about ruby ;)
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13:02 < hokapoka> Ignore my questions, I thought I was right about the
syntax.
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13:18 < Sh4rK> is there an append() or push() function for slices?
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13:19 < hokapoka> Sh4rK: result := append(s1, s2)
13:19 < Sh4rK> ok, then push()
13:20 < Sh4rK> and pop()
13:20 < Sh4rK> but I found heap package
13:20 < Sh4rK> i think it's what I was looking for
13:20 < hokapoka> http://golang.org/doc/effective_go.html#append
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13:20 < hokapoka> Just use append or write your own.
13:20 < kuroneko> append is awesome.
13:20 < str1ngs> http://code.google.com/p/go-wiki/wiki/SliceTricks
13:21 < kuroneko> pop is a trivial slice trick
13:21 < hokapoka> There's a nice guide on the wiki...
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13:21 < Sh4rK> ok
13:21 < hokapoka> oh hah, as str1ngs just linked
13:21 < Sh4rK> thanks
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13:23 < kuroneko> didn't know about the guide, I had t work it all out
myself!  >_>
13:23 < kuroneko> although it's pretty obvious when you read the bit on
slices
13:23 < aiju> we finally have a wiki?
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13:27 < wayneeseguin> kuroneko: oh?  :)
13:27 < kuroneko> wayneeseguin: I'm vaugely familiar with RVM.  :)
13:33 < wayneeseguin> ahh gotcha :)
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13:35 < knowmercy> is there a go-dev on irc?
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13:36 < aiju> knowmercy: there is #go-nuts..
13:36 < aiju> ;P
13:36 < knowmercy> yes :)
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13:37 < kuroneko> I know we talked implementational guts stuff here when go
first releases
13:37 < kuroneko> released even
13:37 < knowmercy> I want to find out why the openbsd syscalls haven't gone
in tree yet :)
13:38 < kuroneko> can't help there
13:38 < knowmercy> yeah :/
13:38 < kuroneko> I'm a rebel - I only submit patches via the issue tracker
;)
13:38 < niemeyer> knowmercy: The codereview is the right place to ask that
13:38 < niemeyer> Hello everybody, btw
13:38 < knowmercy> I may as well, but the last I saw it said LGTM, Will go
in when the build is unbroken
13:38 < aiju> as russ cox has sayed
13:39 < aiju> IRC is a source of misinformation and lies
13:39 < kuroneko> aiju: sure, but nothing beats actually being able to talk
to people and get feedback quickly
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13:42 < knowmercy> http://codereview.appspot.com/4798060/
13:44 < knowmercy> ok, I emailed again :)
13:44 < knowmercy> that should let some folks know that there are indeed
folks out there who want Go on openbsd!
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13:46 < alm> does openbsd even support USB yet
13:46 < knowmercy> hmmm?
13:50 < knowmercy> oh yes, we support memory and cpu's now too!
13:50 < niemeyer> knowmercy: He's trolling..  don't fall on it
13:50 < knowmercy> fill them with hate and can even spew out emails!
13:50 < mpl> how about mice?
13:50 < mpl> do they still need biscuits to run?
13:51 < knowmercy> :)
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13:53 < knowmercy> I downloaded tha code review diff...  Hopefully it
applies...  but for now, a meeting
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14:00 < Sh4rK> is there a raw string literal in go?
14:00 < Sh4rK> to use with regexps
14:01 < Kahvi> Sh4rk, rawstring = `Can contain newlines and stuff`
14:01 < jnwhiteh> Raw string literals are character sequences between back
quotes ``
14:01 < jnwhiteh> http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html#String_literals
14:02 < Sh4rK> and I can put \ in them too?
14:03 < Kahvi> A bit off topic: What key combination is used for back quotes
on US keyboard layout?
14:03 < Kahvi> Sh4rk, yes.
14:03 < jnwhiteh> Kahvi: there's just a key for it
14:03 < Sh4rK> ok
14:03 < Kahvi> Damn, I need Shift + 'key next to backspace'
14:04 < jnwhiteh> I think on many keyboards it is to the left of the '1'
key, along with the tilde (~)
14:04 < Kahvi> Always found that a bit annoying but I'm glad I don't need to
use those much.
14:05 < Kahvi> Tilde is another annoying one.  AltGr + 'key below the key
next to backspace' :|
14:06 < kuroneko> I do think that we're somewhat fortunate in Australia
having adopted the US keyboard layout rather than the UK one...  >_>
14:06 < kuroneko> despite a lot of the early 80s generation micros having
UKish keyboards
14:09 < jnwhiteh> I still don't quite understand the presence of ¬ on the UK
keyboard :P
14:10 < jnwhiteh> but alas =)
14:10 < Sh4rK> on mine it is alt+7
14:10 < Sh4rK> (hungarian) :)
14:11 < Kahvi> Finnish keyboard doesn't seem to have anything strange on it
14:12 < nicka> With ¬ on the keyboard you can easily ¬_¬
14:13 < Kahvi> I'd like to try dvorak or das layout but I'm afraid of the
change.  :|
14:13 < jnwhiteh> I've heard colemak is good, but I wouldn't want to lose my
qwerty-ness
14:15 < Kahvi> Now that I get a laptop at school I could try das on it as
I'll be the only one using it.
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15:25 < Slant> Is there an equivalent to a BufferWriter?  That is, a Writer
interface that saves in-memory to a []byte.
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15:26 < exch> bytes.Buffer
15:29 < Slant> exch: Tops, thanks!
15:29 < Slant> I'm blind.  :-)
15:29 < aiju> import "braille"
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15:30 < mpl> aiju: I bet it ships a type that implements a Reader :)
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15:47 < knowmercy> dang that diff must not have applied cleanly
15:48 < knowmercy> dear go developers, I'd love to see the openbsd stuff in
tree, <3 Brandon
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17:13 < icey> Is it an appropriate approach to use a goroutine per user for
a streaming web app?
17:14 < icey> As a use case example: a streaming stock ticker app where
users are subscribed to specific tickers
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17:28 < niemeyer> icey: It's fine in principle
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17:29 < icey> niemeyer: great, thanks :)
17:31 < niemeyer> icey: np
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17:32 < TheMue> niemeyer: Any idea why your mgo is ok in dashboard, my
tideland packages not?  I'm using the current release (not weekly) and have my
packages releases tagged.
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17:39 < niemeyer> TheMue: No, I don't really know..  I also don't know why
some packages simply do not show the description
17:41 < TheMue> niemeyer: Thx, I'll ask Andrew.
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18:24 < Gertm> Is there a good working nurses (or curses-like) library for
Go?
18:24 < aiju> i hope not ;P
18:25 < aiju> but there is no good GUI library either so i should just shut
up
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18:25 < nicka> Gertm: https://github.com/nsf/termbox
18:25 < nicka> http://go-lang.cat-v.org/library-bindings
18:26 < Gertm> nicka: I couldn't get that one to work
18:26 < aiju> then poke nsf
18:26 < nicka> so that's what you meant by good
18:26 < Gertm> Yes, I meant one that is goinstallable and stuff
18:27 < nicka> so you couldn't get it working through goinstall or it's
buggy to the point that it doesn't work?
18:27 < aiju> i'm sure it's yet another silly go change
18:27 < aiju> like func is spelled funk now or something
18:27 < Gertm> I cloned the github repo and tried to compile it & the
example but it complains
18:27 < aiju> Gertm: 1.  complain at the other or 2.  fix it yourself
18:27 < aiju> nsf should be here on freenode, just PRIVMSG him
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18:28 < Gertm> Ok, I was just wondering if there were other projects like
it.  But I'll keep looking into it first.
18:28 < Gertm> aiju: going with option 2 to start :)
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18:33 < nicka> Gertm: if it's broken due to go changes, gofix might be of
use to you
18:34 < aiju> we need a gobreak
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18:48 < yebyen> aiju: break my code according to the changes that are
planned?
18:48 < yebyen> :)
18:49 < aiju> yebyen: no ..  for that you just need to wait
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19:09 < Gertm> Anyone have a working Emacs+Flymake setup for Go?
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19:15 < erus`> blah go blah generics
19:16 < KirkMcDonald> erus`: This sounds like a reasoned and eloquent
argument.
19:16 < qeed> was that for or against
19:17 < aiju> blah go blah inline sql
19:17 < erus`> qeed: it was a superposition of both
19:18 < aiju> blah go blah content-addressed scm metadata proxy
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19:37 < knowmercy> I'm really surprised at the documentation for go
19:37 < knowmercy> I updated to the weekly and the docs and examples
reflected the changes updated in the weekly code base!
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19:50 < CoverSlide> godoc --http=:8080 ftw!
19:55 < huin> it is rather handy
19:57 < aiju> web browsers are the new operating systems
19:57 < aiju> i wonder when we'll be running just web br..  nevermind
19:58 < knowmercy> yeah
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19:59 < knowmercy> I'm always doing godoc -http:7080
19:59 < knowmercy> <3 that!
19:59 < aiju> i prefer doing godoc package
19:59 < knowmercy> good!
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20:02 < zeebo> no capturing required
20:02 < zeebo> oops wrong channel!  :)
20:02 < aiju> zeebo is planning a terrorist attack
20:02 < aiju> no hostages
20:03 < knowmercy> I've said this before, but never in here...  We've come
full circle from the days of green screens where everything ran on the server and
only display data went to the user, then we went to "PC" and now we're back to the
same thing only with browsers instead of green screens :)
20:03 < aiju> knowmercy: you're certainly not the first
20:03 < nicka1> pastel green screen now
20:03 < knowmercy> with SS :)
20:03 < knowmercy> *CSS
20:03 < aiju> haha
20:03 < aiju> Cᛋᛋ
20:04 < nicka1> haha
20:04 < huin> knowmercy: note that HTML5, JS etc.  make the browser more
like the PC again
20:04 < knowmercy> yeah, in a way
20:04 < huin> and so the cycle continues :)
20:04 < aiju> huin: AJAX goes back
20:04 < huin> only with more layers
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20:05 < exch> You'll have a terminal in your PC in your terminal in your PC
in your terminal soon
20:05 < aiju> you could load some sort of executable code into terminals
20:05 < knowmercy> now our "green screen" can have access to our microphone
and listen to us say what we want to do
20:05 < aiju> so it wasn't entirely "pure" back then either
20:05 < huin> depends what you mean by "pure"
20:05 < aiju> talking to the PC--terminal dichotomy people are making
20:06 < aiju> *about
20:06 < huin> i guess the PC could exist and be functional in its own right
20:06 < huin> HTML5 apps...  well.  maybe.  in theory.
20:06 < knowmercy> aiju: you strike me as someone who needs a hug
20:06 < aiju> hahahahaha
20:06 < knowmercy> :)
20:06 < aiju> knowmercy: the nazi references?
20:06 < knowmercy> just gathering data points
20:07 < aiju> you're not the first to say THAT, either ;P
20:07 < knowmercy> awww, well I think you're great
20:07 < dlowe> The chromebook is like the "thin clients" of the 80s, too
20:07 < knowmercy> yup
20:08 < knowmercy> only it plays angry birds better
20:08 < aiju> With limited offline capability and a boot time, according to
Google, of eight seconds, Chromebooks are primarily designed to be used while
connected to the Internet.[7]
20:08 < aiju> wow
20:08 < aiju> eight seconds
20:08 < dlowe> I've got one.  It's nice.
20:08 < aiju> i mean, entire eight seconds
20:09 < dlowe> that's including POST and everything
20:09 < knowmercy> I've got a CR-48 with an upgraded mSATA running linux and
it's good enough to write go on and talk to you guys :)
20:09 * exch can drink a mug of coffee in 8 seconds
20:09 < knowmercy> that's cold to login prompt
20:09 < aiju> my 9front laptop boots in maybe 10 seconds
20:09 < aiju> from off to rio
20:09 < dlowe> that's nice for you
20:09 < aiju> boot time hasn't been improving since decades
20:09 < knowmercy> I want to say it's much faster than 8 seconds
20:09 < aiju> it's amazing
20:10 < aiju> although ...  windows 2000 was horrible
20:10 < dlowe> aiju: good enough boot time is good enough
20:10 < knowmercy> aiju: one point to mention is that we're booting faster
than you on less powerful hardware
20:11 < aiju> knowmercy: huh?  less powerful?
20:11 < knowmercy> and from a trusted boot image with security checks
20:11 < aiju> i doubt that
20:11 < knowmercy> aiju: this is just an atom 450 proc
20:11 < aiju> this is just a pentium M
20:12 < huin> naf-wars!  FIGHT!
20:12 < aiju> i just expect a machine whose sole purpose is to run Chrome to
at least start it quickly...
20:12 < knowmercy> it's got to initialize the hardware the same as any
machine
20:13 < aiju> coreboot?
20:13 < huin> i tend to agree that it should be faster
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20:13 < exch> DOes the boot time include establishing a connection to
whatever wifi is available?
20:13 < huin> not saying that that's easy, mind you.  probably some stuff
that needs rethinking.  most likely hardware design
20:13 < aiju> exch: haha
20:13 < aiju> i don't think hardware is an issue
20:14 < huin> depends
20:14 < aiju> with modern machines, boot time really is a pure software
software
20:14 < aiju> *problem
20:14 < knowmercy> ok, my machine goes from cold to login prompt in 5
seconds
20:14 < knowmercy> and the usb tether is active then as well
20:14 < huin> tbh, the Cr-48 is pretty much prototype tech
20:14 < knowmercy> I do have a much faster SSD as well
20:15 < aiju> ah see
20:15 < aiju> i have an old, cheap, slow laptop hard disk
20:15 < knowmercy> that always slows down boot
20:15 < huin> quite impressive then that it boots in 10s
20:15 < exch> solar flares as well
20:15 < aiju> hahahah
20:15 < knowmercy> pesky flairs!
20:16 < knowmercy> this has nothing to do with go
20:16 < aiju> there is no IRC gestapo
20:16 < aiju> is there?
20:17 < aiju> ah wait
20:17 < aiju> uriel
20:17 < knowmercy> so I priced out those low power usage atom firewall, web
boxes for my go webserver, 550 bucks!
20:17 < knowmercy> I may as well use chrome netbooks :)
20:18 < aiju> using generous bullshit calculations i could say my notebook
cost me 500 bucks
20:18 < knowmercy> yeah, that's what the chrome books are selling for
20:18 < aiju> (i actually got it in exchange for writing a driver)
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20:19 < knowmercy> what kinda driver?
20:20 < aiju> network driver
20:20 < aiju> for 9front
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20:54 < f2f> does json.Unmarshal support tags?
20:54 < f2f> it doesn't look like it :(
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21:01 < chilts> kylelemons++ for spotting my weel-formed mistake :)
21:01 * chilts doesn't know his nick
21:02 < chilts> weel=well :)
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21:17 < f2f> ah, got it.  Unmarshal actually wants the double-quotes in.
21:17 < f2f> tag should be blah int `json:"blahint"`
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21:33 < chilts> f2f: that one got me the other day too
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22:04 < tdnrad> Can someone point me to some documentation on how to use
other people's libraries in Go? I'm still getting used to the make system and want
to use "gopcap" in my program.
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22:08 < TheSeeker> I think it's goinstall
22:08 < str1ngs> knowmercy: my desktop boots in 4s
22:08 < TheSeeker> tdnrad: http://golang.org/cmd/goinstall/
22:12 < tdnrad> TheSeeker: ok thanks I'll look into that.
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22:13 < tdnrad> TheSeeker: I tried goinstall from the repository but it
didn't work..  I'm under the impression the library might have to be
"goinstallable", what makes soemthing goinstallable I'm unsure.
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22:16 < exch> For the mooment, the code has to be in a remote repository
(github, google code, bitbucket) and all of it's surce should reside in the same
directory.  goinstall does not use the makefile in a code repo
22:16 < exch> *moment
22:16 < exch> *source
22:17 * TheSeeker hasn't actualyl tried doing anything with go for months, lets
others talk >_>
22:17 < str1ngs> tdnrad: be easier if you gave some errors
22:17 < str1ngs> tdnrad: or paste your goinstall line
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22:20 < tdnrad> str1ngs: I tried `goinstall github.com/strohman/gopcap` ..
the errors are several 'undefined reference' errors which I can easily pastebin
but seem to have nothing to do with the code since it compiles fine with the
makefile..  unless goinstall has trouble with the C in it?
22:20 < tdnrad> And by C I mean the language C...
22:22 < exch> goinstall works with cgo packages, but the Go source needs to
define the appropriate //#cgo tag lines to tell goinstall what to link against.
Basically the CGO_CFLAGS and CGO_LDFLAGS values that are in the makefile, shuold
be in those lines
22:22 < str1ngs> tdnrad: ya sounds like a cgo project
22:22 < tdnrad> exch: ok.  I can probably manage that
22:22 < exch> Like this
https://github.com/jteeuwen/glfw/blob/master/glfw.go#L7
22:23 < str1ngs> imo its better to use pkg-config if you can depends on the
project
22:23 < exch> ya
22:23 < tdnrad> hmm, never heard of pkg-config, will take a read
22:23 < tdnrad> exch: thanks for the link
22:23 < exch> You can now put '//#cgo pkg-config: mylib' in there
22:23 < exch> That will not work for windows though
22:23 < str1ngs> poinstall supports pkg-config
22:23 < str1ngs> goinstall*
22:25 < tdnrad> Excellent guys this gives me a bit to read and something to
do.  Thanks for your time.
22:26 < str1ngs> tdnrad: you can in theory reuse the LDFLAGS etc.  for the
time being pkg-config is just sugar really
22:27 < tdnrad> str1ngs: you mean just reuse the flags from the makefile?
22:27 < str1ngs> tdnrad: http://golang.org/cmd/cgo/ should explain better
22:27 < str1ngs> tdnrad: right
22:27 < tdnrad> awesome
22:27 < str1ngs> tdnrad: the website will explain the syntax
22:27 < str1ngs> but like a said depending how complex the C lib is
pkg-config is more portable.  short of windows
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22:32 < str1ngs> tdnrad: once you get that sorted out its just a matter of
importing . something like import gopcap "github.com/strohman/gopcap"
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23:16 < chilts> heh, I got myself a Gopher ...  a plastic one rather than a
fluffy one ...  a friend got it for me from OSCON :)
23:16 < chilts> sweetness follows
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23:17 < str1ngs> nice
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--- Log closed Tue Aug 23 00:00:20 2011