--- Log opened Fri Dec 10 00:00:36 2010
--- Day changed Fri Dec 10 2010
00:00 < exch> Except for the memory management, which can also be an
important consideration in some situations.  But that's the tradeoff one makes for
having a GC I suppose
00:01 < exch> I for one am glad it's there
00:01 < rmmh> argh
00:01 < foocraft> does GC run on a separate thread?
00:01 < rmmh> sorry for the accidental golang-dev spam
00:01 < exch> foocraft: I have no idea how and where it runs
00:01 < foocraft> http://news.ncsu.edu/releases/wmssolihinthreads/
00:05 < exch> That sounds like the very definition of how goroutines
communicate with eachother through channels
00:06 < rmmh> not really
00:06 < rmmh> it sounds like just a multithreaded GC
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00:33 < Zerelda> at least nedmalloc is even released
http://www.nedprod.com/programs/portable/nedmalloc/ unlike that other allocator
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01:29 < plexdev> http://is.gd/it494 by [Nigel Tao] in go/src/pkg/html/ --
html: parse <table><tr><td> tags.
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02:12 < uriel> 23:48 < dho_> academia also produces cutting edge
research
02:12 < uriel> more like cutting edge bloated piles of stinking garbage
02:13 < uriel> er, sorry, got carried away once more, /me goes back to
ramble in #cat-v ;P
02:21 < Tv> cutting edge proofs of concept..
02:21 < Tv> very different from "here, use this"
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03:39 < exch> So much for java (what was left of it):
https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/the_asf_resigns_from_the
03:39 < exch> Go needs to move in and win some of the lost souls :)
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04:02 < KirkMcDonald> Go's package namespaces don't have nearly enough
levels in them to compete with Java!
04:02 < skelterjohn> lol
04:02 < rhencke> needs more cowbell?
04:03 < |Craig|> I have a bunch of Java code to write for classes this
weekend.  I wish they would stop using it at a teaching language
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04:05 < skelterjohn> considering how widely used it is in some industries,
it is appropriate to use for teaching
04:05 < skelterjohn> it all depends on what you're trying to give your
students
04:06 < skelterjohn> if you want to make them really good coders, java is
probably not the right option
04:06 < skelterjohn> if you want to turn them into cogs in a wheel, java is
ok
04:06 < rhencke> if you want to make them art majors, use brainf***
04:07 < Zerelda>
http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/u64q/benchmark.php?test=all&lang=gpp&lang2=java
04:07 < |Craig|> Lets see, all intro programming classes: Java, software
design and implementation class: java.  Basically any class not about specific
languages at my college (And the University of Washington ain't no little school)
seems to be in java.
04:07 < cbeck> Grad or undergrad?
04:08 < |Craig|> undergrad currently, I can't say anything about the grad
level stuff
04:09 < cbeck> Is *nix used there much?  or does redmond's proximity drive
that to the edges?
04:09 < cbeck> (UDub is on my shortlist for gradschool)
04:09 < |Craig|> So far I havent made a distributable in any of my
programming classes.  Not even a jar file.  Seems odd to me
04:09 < |Craig|> cbeck: the CS labs are mixed fedora installs and windows 7
04:11 < rmmh> UIllinois uses C++ in most classes
04:11 < |Craig|> I mostly see people coding java in eclipse though, and they
don't care which os they use
04:11 < rmmh> my favorite are OS Classes in Java
04:11 < cbeck> Heh
04:12 < cbeck> Better than the OS class I just finished, was in a BASIC-like
dsl created for the class
04:12 < uriel> cbeck: I bet that DSL was 'cutting edge'!
04:12 < cbeck> No. Very much no.
04:12 < uriel> isn't academia great?
04:13 < cbeck> Did you see that video on reddit of the PSU prof's Relay
Computer?
04:13 < cbeck> He wrote this language
04:13 < uriel> cbeck: 'scare quotes' were not enough to indicate sarcasm?
;P
04:13 < |Craig|> At least there is an optional programming languages class.
Standard ML, Scheme and Java Script wouldn't have been my choice for languages to
cover, but its not too bad.  We wrote an (incomplete) basic interpreter in scheme.
04:13 < cbeck> There's a reason he's a hardware hacker and not a lang
designer
04:14 < uriel> cbeck: so what is he doing desiging custom languages to use
on an OS class?
04:14 * uriel stops trying to make sense of the world
04:15 < rmmh> if I were implementing a language on custom hardware I'd
probably do Forth
04:15 < rhencke> forth is fun
04:15 < rhencke> as is its close cousin postscript
04:15 < |Craig|> uriel: you were trying to make sense of the world?  I just
sit back and laugh at it.
04:15 < rhencke> postscript is like forth and logo had a baby
04:16 < uriel> |Craig|: you are much wiser than me :(
04:18 < cbeck> On the plus side, my software engineering prof let me do my
project in Go, so it comes out in the wash
04:23 < exch> So i'm not the only ones who gets this eery postscript vibe
when he's reading Forth?
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04:27 < rmmh> forth and postscript are the two most well-known concatenative
languages
04:28 < exch> I love em
04:28 < exch> There's something perversely satisfying in having to keep
track of the stack contents in your brain when you're writing stuff in it
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04:30 < rmmh> I love how trivial they are to write a JIT for
04:30 < exch> ya
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04:36 < TheSeeker> huh, no scramble to get bug # 1337 for go?
04:36 < rhencke> TheSeeker: i was thinking that, too.
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07:51 < vermi> can someone suggest a way to turn \n in a string into an
actual newline?
07:51 < cbeck> strings.Replace
07:52 < vermi> ah yeah, i had thought of that, but honestly i don't know
what to replace \n with
07:54 < vermi> can i specify it as a unicode code point?
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07:55 < krutcha1> I think you can do it both ways
07:55 < krutcha1> as an escape character or unicode
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07:57 < krutcha1> http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html#Character_literals
07:57 < vermi> krutcha1: what i want to do is replace the string \n with the
actual byte
07:57 < krutcha1> http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html#Tokens
07:57 < krutcha1> so you see a \n in a readable string
07:57 < krutcha1> and want to make a newline out of it?
07:57 < vermi> yeah
07:57 < vermi> this is for an http.Post()
07:58 < vermi> the php i'm submitting to doesn't parse the \n
07:58 < vermi> so i need to send it the actual byte
07:58 < krutcha1> try something like strings.Replace(msg, "\\n", "\n") ?
07:59 < krutcha1> strings.Replace(msg, "\\n", "\n", -1) rather
08:02 < krutcha1> like this: http://pastebin.com/dieyViT0
08:02 < krutcha1> unless I misunderstood
08:07 < vermi> yeah, that's basically it
08:07 < krutcha1> cool, glad that worked
08:08 < vermi> basically we have a command, let's say !quote, which requires
a non-blank argument.  so someone says !quote blah\nblah
08:08 < vermi> well that \n is a string, not a newline byte
08:08 < vermi> so i just couldn't figure out how to handle the replace
08:08 < vermi> so thanks for the tip D:
08:08 < vermi> :D
08:10 < krutcha1> no prob
08:10 < vermi> now it's time to sleep
08:10 < vermi> i spend too much time on this crap, when i should be sleeping
08:10 < vermi> pisses the girlfriend off to no end
08:10 < krutcha1> another source of no sleep!
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14:13 < h0ney> 한국분 계시나요?
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14:14 < h0ney> Is Korea?
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14:18 < wrtp> is a question?
14:27 < niemeyer> Is!
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14:57 < xyproto> h0ney: translate.google.com
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15:00 < wrtp> h0ney: 당신이 부탁하고 싶은 질문이 있어요?
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15:01 < wrtp> isn't unicode great
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15:01 < h0ney> wrtp 한국분은 아니시죠?  ㅋㅋ
15:02 < wrtp> xyproto: hmm, translate.google.com has its limitations :-)
15:03 < skelterjohn> 부하분 죠있 요고당니!
15:04 < wrtp> Buhabun jyoit yogodangni!  nice.
15:04 < exch> that certainly clears things up
15:04 < xyproto> ;)
15:04 < skelterjohn> i copied random characters from the messages already
posted
15:05 < wrtp> h0ney: 죄송합니다, 우리는 한국 말로하지 않습니다.
15:07 < h0ney> wrtp //Yes , Thx :)
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16:19 < skelterjohn> it's not clear to me how to resize the window given by
x11.NewWindow() - anyone have a pointer?
16:20 < exch> skelterjohn: as far as I know, the draw/x11 window is very
simple.  It doesn't seem to allow any sort of configuration beyond just displaying
it and modifying the screen content (image)
16:20 < skelterjohn> i see
16:21 < exch> the go xcb implementation is probably a better bet if you need
more control, but as i'm currently finding out, it's a lot more complicated
16:21 < exch> http://code.google.com/p/x-go-binding/
16:21 < nsf> xgb and xcb isn't very usable
16:21 < skelterjohn> i'm just doing some experimentation visualization for
debugging stuff, so i can probably just not resize the window
16:21 < skelterjohn> thanks
16:21 < nsf> skelterjohn: tried using gtk?
16:22 < skelterjohn> i don't like gtk
16:22 < nsf> well, I can't help you then
16:22 < skelterjohn> :'(
16:22 < nsf> drawing directly using x11 is a very bad idea
16:23 < skelterjohn> i imagine it depends on what you want to draw
16:23 < nsf> not really
16:23 < skelterjohn> i literally want to color individual pixels on the
screen
16:23 < skelterjohn> and it is very clear how to do that with exp/draw
16:23 < nsf> opengl and sdl will be better for this
16:23 < skelterjohn> define "better"
16:23 < nsf> performance-wise
16:23 < skelterjohn> i don't need performance
16:23 < nsf> ok
16:24 < skelterjohn> i just need ease of coding
16:24 < exch> they also add a ton of extra dependencies which you dont have
to worry about with the go implementations of x11/xcb
16:24 < skelterjohn> when possible, i prefer to do everything with pure go
16:24 < nsf> exch: have you written at least one app using xcb or xgb?
16:24 < skelterjohn> i don't like language interfacing
16:25 < exch> nsf: Nope, but that's not a reason to not do it.  I'm well
aware it's painful (currently writing one), but I have no intention of giving up
that easily
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16:26 < exch> Besides, the actual drawing will not be done using direct X
calls.  I just need access to the image buffer and have some rudimentary control
over the window size/position and style
16:26 < nsf> I know that because I've written two panels for X11 and there
was a time when I was deciding: xcb vs.  xlib..  choice was obvious..
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16:26 < nsf> even though xlib kind of sucks
16:27 < nsf> exch: hehe, that's where fun starts
16:27 < nsf> X doesn't have image buffers :)
16:27 < nsf> it has few extensions to work with them
16:27 < nsf> ximage, xrender
16:28 < wrtp> skelterjohn: exp/x11 is still pretty rudimentary.  i hope that
nigel tao will get back onto it sometime.
16:28 < nsf> xshm
16:28 < nsf> also
16:33 < skelterjohn> fun quote from the X11 wiki: "X derives its name as a
successor to a pre-1983 window system called W (the letter preceding X in the
English alphabet).  W ran under the V operating system."
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16:35 < nsf> it's more like sad quote
16:35 < skelterjohn> oh, you!
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16:55 < cde> nsf :)
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18:27 < foocraft>
http://electures.informatik.uni-freiburg.de/portal/download/3/6950/thm15%20-%20parallel%20merging.pdf
18:28 < skelterjohn> nice delayed reaction
18:30 < foocraft> skelterjohn, it took me some time to find one that's good
18:30 < foocraft> I mean, I wouldn't give you the link for something that
doesn't make sense to me
18:30 < skelterjohn> :)
18:34 < skelterjohn> lots of pages
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19:48 < plexdev> http://is.gd/ivOdu by [Russ Cox] in go/src/cmd/nm/ -- nm:
silently ignore .o files in .a files
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19:48 < plexdev> http://is.gd/ivOdO by [Russ Cox] in go/src/cmd/cgo/ -- cgo:
avoid self-interference of global names
19:48 < plexdev> http://is.gd/ivOev by [Russ Cox] in go/src/pkg/math/ --
math: s/MinFloat/SmallestNonzeroFloat/
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19:51 < hagna> does go have goto?
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19:58 < exch> yes
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21:34 < Messanger> world leaders setting you all up right now to get
microchipped by RFID microchips with identity/healthcare/credit information into
their new world order why they are folding the economy , their solution to the
problem they are causing is the RFID microchip
http://www.scribd.com/doc/44997148/The-Mark-of-the-Beast Romans 10:13 all who call
upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
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21:40 < exch> orly
21:44 < dho> yarly
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21:46 < dho> hm
21:46 < dho> http://mail-index.netbsd.org/tech-security/1999/07/10/0000.html
21:46 < dho> I should talk to thor
21:46 < dho> he's a buddy of mine
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22:51 < plexdev> http://is.gd/iwj0h by [Robert Griesemer] in 2 subdirs of
go/ -- godoc: first cut at textual search
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22:56 * TheSeeker lols at bug 1337.
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Faster, Easier.  http://miranda-im.org]
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23:56 < TheSeeker> huh, did the nntp package get bundled into some other
package?  or was it just dropped?
--- Log closed Sat Dec 11 00:00:01 2010