--- Log opened Tue Jan 04 00:00:01 2011
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00:01 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k2VBJ by [Rob Pike] in go/src/pkg/regexp/ --
regexp: fix performance bug, make anchored searches fail fast.
00:01 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k2VBZ by [Rob Pike] in go/src/pkg/regexp/ --
regexp: fix prefix bug.
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02:09 < daxt> How can i make some $$ with Go which helps me to make my
living while helping to develop it ?
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02:15 < exch> Not sure how the two go hand in hand, but they are not
mutually exclusive.  Just make something you can sell and submit patches for
anything you feel is wrong or broken.
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02:16 < exch> patches for Go that is
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02:20 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k3mfw by [Andrew Gerrand] in
go/misc/dashboard/builder/ -- gobuilder: prefix the tarball with 'go.', tweak
release regexp
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02:32 < adu> hi
02:33 < adu>
http://straymindcough.blogspot.com/2011/01/golang-proposals.html
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02:38 < Namegduf> Go is Turing Complete
02:38 < Namegduf> It can express anything C++ can express
02:38 < Namegduf> I'm tired of hearing that inane argument
02:39 < Namegduf> It just can't express it in the same way.
02:40 < adu> of course its Turing complete
02:40 < adu> who said it wasn't?
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02:40 < Namegduf> The blog post claims it can't express everything C++ can.
02:40 < Namegduf> It can certainly express every algorithm C++ can.
02:41 < adu> OK, but what about templates?
02:41 < Namegduf> What about them?
02:41 < Namegduf> You can express anything done in templates just by writing
out the versions used.
02:41 < adu> How would you express std::deque<T> in Go?
02:42 < Namegduf> std::deque<T> is not an algorithm, it's an abstract
thing.
02:42 < adu> right, but that's like saying 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 when what you
really want to express is "number"
02:42 < nsf> proposals..  again :(
02:43 < Namegduf> You may as well ask how Go lets you express multiple
inheritance.
02:43 < adu> I'm not concerned with multiple inheritance
02:43 < adu> besides Go does allow multiple inheritance of struct fields,
which makes me happy
02:44 < Namegduf> I suppose Go cannot express every arbitrary conceptual
thing in any other language, but no other language can, and it's hardly a
disadvantage.
02:44 < adu> Lisp can
02:44 < Namegduf> It can express any algorithm, and that is all that is
required.
02:44 < adu> by whom?
02:44 < adu> you may not require it, but someone else may
02:44 < Namegduf> By anyone solving a problem.
02:45 < adu> that's a rash assumption
02:45 < Namegduf> By anyone writing any kind of program at all, actually.
02:45 < Namegduf> No, it's pretty basic CS
02:45 < adu> there are different schools of thought on that
02:45 < Namegduf> No, there aren't.
02:46 < Namegduf> Anything that can be done in one Turing complete language
can be done in another.
02:47 < Namegduf> You need to find an argument for things other than "it
can't express arbitrary conceptual things other languages can" because unless they
impact Turing completeness they by definition don't stop you solving any actual
problem
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02:47 < Namegduf> And solving actual problems is, I think, the point
02:48 < adu> you keep talking about requirements for Turing completeness
02:49 < adu> I'm talking about requirements from managers and clients and
stuff
02:49 < Namegduf> If those requirements are for a thing to be computed then
either something Turing complete can do it or it can't.
02:50 < Namegduf> Generics has no impact on it being possible to do or not.
02:50 < adu> true
02:50 < vsmatck> true but irrelevant.
02:51 < |Craig|> you can implement a C++ interpreter in Go
02:51 < adu> true
02:51 < Namegduf> Highly relevant to my point.
02:51 < adu> Namegduf: what is your point?
02:51 < vsmatck> What is your point?
02:52 < Namegduf> That arguing that things cannot be expressed due to lack
of generics is either wrong (if said things are stuff to compute) or irrelevant
(if said things are conceptual, expressed not to the machine but to other
programmers reading the code)
02:53 < Namegduf> And thus arguments that generics are beneficial need to be
based on better grounds
02:53 < Namegduf> Benefits to conciseness, safety, etc
02:53 < vsmatck> I think you misinterpret his blog post.  He's talking about
expressiveness, not turing completeness.
02:53 < adu> I think brevity is a good argument
02:53 < vsmatck> His introduction is not super well written tho.
02:53 < adu> vsmatck: I can change it
02:54 < Namegduf> So far as I can tell, the intro is the only place putting
arguments down that generics are useful and required
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02:54 < vsmatck> adu: Oh this is your blog?
02:54 < adu> yes
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02:54 < Namegduf> And no effort is made to compare the costs fo the generic
implementations with the benefits of generics
02:54 * adu is Andrew
02:54 < vsmatck> Ah, in that case lemme try to be more specific on my
criticism.
02:54 < adu> vsmatck: I would appreciate it :)
02:54 < Namegduf> Because this "expressiveness" is treated as a kind of
ultimate good
02:55 < adu> maybe I assume "expressive" and "brief" are the same thing
02:55 < vsmatck> If it wasn't we'd all write in machine code.  (is this
reduction to absurd?)
02:55 < Namegduf> Yes, it is.
02:55 < Namegduf> If it was, we'd all write in the most expressive language
available with the most constructs to represent the most conceptual things.
02:55 < |Craig|> some generics designs allow complex data structures to be
implemented with out major redundancy or performance hits for multiple different
types.  Type safety and syntax aside, that about it.
02:55 < Namegduf> It'd be awful.
02:56 < |Craig|> as far as brief code goes, we can manually edit compressed
source files.  Way more concise!
02:57 < |Craig|> some generics are a kind of compression really (not that
its bad)
02:57 < adu> Namegduf: lol why would that be awful?
02:58 < adu> Namegduf: or are you talking about OMG?
02:58 < Namegduf> You seriously think a language with hundreds of constructs
to represent any conceivable conceptual thing would be the best language possible?
02:59 < vsmatck> adu: I guess mainly the part of the intro I don't like is
the last sentence of the first paragraph.
02:59 < adu> hundreds, no
03:01 < adu> would removing "may or may not" strengthen my argument?
03:02 < Namegduf> It's kind of a useless sentence.
03:02 < vsmatck> Your meaning only becomes clear to me when I read below.
03:02 < Namegduf> If you're talking about expressing algorithms, as I've
said, you're wrong.
03:02 < Namegduf> if you're talking about expressing arbitrary concepts, you
should compare against writing text, not a programming language.
03:02 < Namegduf> And it's kind of a weak point.
03:02 < Namegduf> "Expressing arbitrary concepts" isn't really a function of
a programming language.
03:03 < vsmatck> Something like, "However, when comparing C++ to Go there
are certain generic algorithms which can only be expressed in C++".  I'm not a
super good writer tho.
03:03 < Namegduf> Eh.
03:03 < Namegduf> Certain algorithms which can only be expressed
generically, maybe.
03:03 < vsmatck> yeah that's better.
03:04 < Namegduf> The algorithm is the same in the language with generics as
the language without, it just has to be written down non-generically
03:04 < vsmatck> Err.  Maybe redundant to what was said.  I dunno.
03:06 < vsmatck>
http://blackbeltreview.files.wordpress.com/2009/12/singleresponsibilityprinciple2_71060858.jpg
03:07 < vsmatck> I think the reason generics isn't in go yet is because they
couldn't figure out how to make it fit right.  Can't just throw stuff together of
you get C++.  lol
03:08 < vsmatck> Seems like certain features are more "bolt-on" than others.
Concurrency seems like an example of something with is definitely not bolt-on.
03:08 < adu> OK, I changed that sentance
03:10 < vsmatck> I like that better.  Like Namegduf said the old sentence
was a bit unnecessary.
03:10 < adu> :)
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03:21 < SoniaKeys> hmm.  combining characters aren't letters, and so can't
be used in identifiers.  too bad.
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03:37 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k3AN5 by [Gustavo Niemeyer] in
go/src/cmd/goinstall/ -- goinstall: fix -u for bzr
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04:26 < adu> nsf: you still there?
04:26 < nsf> :)
04:27 < adu> You said "again" can you point me to other proposals?
04:27 < nsf> there were some on the ML
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04:28 < adu> what's a good keyword?  "extension"?
04:28 < nsf> generics
04:29 < nsf> there are a lot of ideas and drafts
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04:29 < nsf> and in that blog post it's also an idea
04:29 < adu> wow there are!!!
04:29 < nsf> it's not a proposal
04:30 < nsf> it covers syntax, but there are much less words about semantics
04:30 < nsf> and implementation
04:31 < nsf> no one should propose anything unless they are ready to
implement it by themselves
04:31 < nsf> I also assume that it means they know how to implement a
feature they want
04:32 < nsf> without such knowledge, "proposals" or "ideas" cost is zero
04:32 < adu> I'm ready to implement it
04:32 < adu> I've already written my own parser
04:32 < nsf> do it :)
04:32 < adu> well it will take awhile
04:32 < adu> did you see my parser?
04:32 < nsf> no
04:33 < adu> hackage.haskell.org/package/language-go
04:33 < nsf> ah..  that one, yes I saw it
04:33 < nsf> I know no haskell, so..  it won't tell me anything anyway :)
04:33 < adu> its very alpha
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04:34 < adu> also, its quite readable even without Haskell knowledge
04:37 < nsf> that's a good thing i guess
04:39 < nsf> as for me..  I don't think Go needs generics
04:40 < nsf> because this "small" feature immediately turns Go into a
completely different language
04:41 < nsf> I like Go, but whether or no I like this abstract language, I
don't know
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04:43 < nsf> ehm..  anyways
04:43 < nsf> no generics is a valid solution to a generics problem for me :)
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04:53 < crazy2be> go practically *has* generics with interfaces and such,
doesn't it?
04:53 < nsf> some form of them in runtime, yes
04:54 < crazy2be> like rather than saying template<T> like you would
in C++, you just define an interface and accept that as an argument
04:54 < crazy2be> however, it is slower
04:54 < adu> crazy2be: no, it has polymorphism, not generics
04:54 < crazy2be> adu: What is the exact difference there?
04:54 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k3NMS by [Nigel Tao] in go/doc/ -- doc: update
Effective Go for template API change.
04:55 < adu> crazy2be: polymorphism is vague, generics generally implies
_parametric_ polymorphism
04:55 < nsf> go interfaces are pretty much the same thing as C++'s concepts
(that were proposed for C++0x), but in runtime, instead of compile time
04:56 < nsf> what does parametric mean?  there are parameters
04:56 < nsf> interface is a parameter
04:56 < nsf> the function behaviour is guided by interface implementation
04:56 < adu> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_polymorphism
04:57 < nsf> "Using parametric polymorphism, a function or a data type can
be written generically so that it can handle values identically without depending
on their type.[2] Such functions and data types are called generic functions and
generic datatypes respectively and form the basis of generic programming."
04:57 < nsf> so..  what's wrong with that
04:58 < adu> that's good
04:58 < nsf> that what interfaces are about
04:58 < nsf> Print handles values of different types
04:58 < nsf> fmt.Print I mean
04:58 < nsf> it can print everything, literally
04:58 < crazy2be> like the only use i can see for generics is in writing
functions that deal with floats, ints, and doubles for example
04:59 < crazy2be> like as in any one of those
04:59 < crazy2be> since the overhead involved in defining an interface would
be unacceptable
04:59 < nsf> for me the only excuse for generics is an implementation that
generates optimal code
04:59 < Namegduf> The reason is mostly so the type provided in one instance
can automatically carry over to others.
04:59 < nsf> e.g.  std::sort
04:59 < adu> like "template specialization"?
04:59 < Namegduf> Right
05:00 < Namegduf> Also performance, yah.
05:00 < Namegduf> *yeah
05:00 < adu> like vector<object> = slow, vector<bool> = int
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05:01 < crazy2be> can't the compiler do a certain amount of optimization for
that at compile time tho?
05:01 < vsmatck> In C++ vector<bool> is partial specialized to use
bits.  It requires a proxy object and breaks certain things.  One example is
std::swap.
05:01 < nsf> vector<bool> is a very bad idea
05:02 < vsmatck> There was a proposal to change the specification.  It was a
msitake.
05:02 < adu> nsf: agreed
05:02 < vsmatck> And the C++ people are smart.  So generic stuff can be
complicated.  *shrug*
05:02 < crazy2be> lol
05:02 < nsf> they are smart, but certainly they are not wise
05:02 < Namegduf> The problem with every generics idea I've seen so far is
that they don't do a detailed evaluation of the costs to the language and the
benefits from the change
05:03 < adu> generic stuff _is_ complicated
05:03 < vsmatck> Power is nothing without control.  :)
05:03 < Namegduf> That is, they stay at ideas, they don't say why those
ideas are good.
05:03 < vsmatck> Some generic stuff is complicated.  Not all of it.
05:03 < Namegduf> Or why they're better than their costs.
05:03 < crazy2be> well i'm not convinced of the need for generics still
05:03 < vsmatck> I personally find template metaprogramming
incomprehensible.
05:03 < nsf> Namegduf: agreed
05:03 < nsf> I haven't seen a proposal that mentions linking problems
05:04 < Namegduf> Few seem to discuss implementation at all.
05:04 < vsmatck> It'd be nice to have the the bytes package work on slices
of all types.  Need generics for that.
05:04 < adu> vsmatck: well the Map[K]T => _Map_K_T_ kind of generics is
not that complicated
05:05 < Namegduf> I think simple generics are best done via a preprocessor.
05:05 < crazy2be> vsmatck: yeah, that's the other thing it could be useful
for
05:05 < adu> Namegduf: that's what the ML seems to agree upon
05:05 < Namegduf> I actually kind of like having one, perfectly simple,
perfectly standard Go implementation and generating the other varients from that.
05:05 < crazy2be> so that the strings and bytes packages wouldn't have to be
seperate
05:05 < vsmatck> preprocessory yuck.
05:05 < nsf> I like the idea of a type-safe preprocessor
05:06 < Namegduf> I agree it's yuck, but I think it's less yuck than
yuckifying the language.
05:06 < nsf> but haven't seen one
05:06 < adu> i wonder if it would be possible to implement "interface" via a
preprocessor
05:07 < Namegduf> In short, lack of generics sucks but I've not seen a
properly done pros vs cons argument for a specific generics implementation that
went into the required level of detail, didn't make assumptions that needed
backing.
05:08 < adu> I would love to do that
05:08 < vsmatck> I think the way they're likely to implement it is by
boxing.  Not compile time specialization like C++.  iant was talking about it a
while ago in here.
05:08 < Namegduf> Other stuff in the blog post...  wtf has POSIX to do with
Go?
05:08 < crazy2be> night
05:08 < Namegduf> I assume you're talking about the POSIX C API
05:09 < Namegduf> The one which is wrapped in every package that speaks to
it into idiomatic nice Go.
05:09 < adu> yes
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05:09 < adu> right
05:09 < Namegduf> So why would internal, non-idiomatic structures ever need
to be public?
05:10 < Namegduf> And why is that worth throwing away the whole point of
case-based public/private, which is the ability to see it at a glance without
checking the declaration?
05:11 < adu> Go is a systems programming language, intended for writing
systems, it is only a matter of time before someone tries to write an OS in Go
05:12 < adu> OS have lots of specialized interfaces, but most useful OSs
have a POSIX interface (even Windows)
05:12 < Namegduf> I think you might be confusing the kernel, and the libc
05:12 < adu> no, I'm talking exclusively about libc
05:13 < adu> POSIX is not the only example
05:13 < Namegduf> So your proposal is to break public/private across the
entire language for the convenience of people writing a libc in Go
05:13 < adu> OpenGL is another example of an ABI that requires lowercase
symbols
05:13 < Namegduf> An API.
05:13 < Namegduf> I think.
05:13 < Namegduf> Anyways, that doesn't explain why these symbols should
cross packages.
05:14 < adu> yes, API, but the API is for C, the stuff in shared libraries
could have been written in any language, like Pascal or GWBASIC for example
05:14 < nsf> adu: it's not true as far as I remember
05:14 < nsf> ah, ABI
05:15 < adu> yes
05:15 < nsf> well, maybe yes
05:15 < nsf> but ABI is not a part of the standard
05:15 < adu> right
05:15 < nsf> afair
05:15 < Namegduf> I'm not sure how this relates to exposing these symbols
across Go packages
05:16 < adu> well, the way I see it is a matter of name mangling
05:16 < adu> lowercase symbols (in my head) are prefixed with
__dont_look_here__
05:17 < Namegduf> Weird.
05:17 < Namegduf> I see them as perfectly usable everywhere I can see them-
merely internal to what I'm working with.
05:17 < adu> and when a compiler tries searching for symbols, it only
searches for non-prefixed symbols in other packages, and both prefixed and
non-prefixed symbols in the current package
05:17 < Namegduf> I suppose a __dont_look__here__ thing would be how Python
would do it.
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05:18 < Namegduf> Or you'd do it in Python.
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05:19 < adu> the way I would implement forced public/private is to modify
the default prefixing/mangling of symbol names
05:19 < adu> so Print would be Print, and print would be
__dont_look_here__print
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05:20 < adu> attrib(public) print would be print, and attrib(private) Print
would be __dont_look_here__Print
05:20 < nsf> :\
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05:26 < adu> Namegduf: "convenience of people writing a libc in Go" is
something I don't quite get
05:27 < adu> to me it seems innevitable
05:28 < adu> there is perhaps a slippery slope
05:28 < adu> people ask for libraries, they get go-specific .a libraries
05:29 < adu> people ask for shared libraries, perhaps go will work with
shared libs in a few years
05:29 < nsf> I don't think so
05:29 < nsf> gccgo works already though
05:29 < adu> not for me
05:30 < adu> anyways, after shared libraries, people will probably want
something other than uppercase symbols, and that's the point of attrib(public)
05:30 < Namegduf> Why?
05:30 < adu> then come milk and cookies
05:31 < nsf> shared Go libraries won't work outside of Go
05:31 < adu> right
05:31 < nsf> because specific runtime is required
05:31 < Namegduf> And even if they did, capital letter names seems minor.
05:32 < Namegduf> And even if they weren't, a specific fix for shared
libraries would seem better than altering the entire language
05:32 < adu> it would certainly give class to POSIX...  StrDup()
05:32 < Namegduf> My point with the libc thing was that making sweeping
changes to a language that increase complexity for everyone to gain a slight
improvement in usability for a tiny percentage of code written in it...
05:33 < adu> understandable
05:33 < adu> I'm well aware how weak slippery slope arguments are
05:34 < Namegduf> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope_fallacy
05:34 < adu> i know, that's why I used the term
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05:53 < adu> Namegduf: so do you have any comments on "pragma"?
05:55 < cbeck> Mine would mostly involve profanity.
05:55 < adu> lol
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14:28 < GilJ_> If I read a string with a ReadString() call, whats 'best' way
to remove the delimeter?
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14:32 < kimelto> GilJ_: something like str[:len(str)-1] ?
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14:33 < GilJ_> kimelto: Ok thanks :)
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15:03 < cde> why are Go strings immutable?
15:04 < taruti> because there is []byte
15:04 < taruti> and bytes.Buffer
15:04 <+iant> Logically speaking, they are constants just like integer
constants.  It does not make sense to speak of changing the value of 3.
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15:05 < cde> but that's not as efficient as stl strings
15:05 <+iant> C/C++ strings are also immutable, people just don't describe
them that way
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15:05 < cde> ah, ok
15:06 <+iant> You could build a type based on []byte which is just as
efficient as an STL string
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15:07 < cde> by the way, erlang has immutable byte arrays iirc
15:07 <+iant> Well, except that Go requires bounds checking and STL does not
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15:08 <+iant> In Go terms I'm not sure what the difference is between an
immustable byte array and a string constant
15:08 <+iant> immutable
15:08 < cde> as string is UTF-8, so seeking is less efficient I guess
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15:09 < jumzi> cde: O, good to know that erlang has it...?
15:09 <+iant> cde: when you index into a string, you are indexing by byte,
not by character
15:10 <+iant> A string constant in Go source code is UTF-8 by default, but
you can use backslashes to include any bytes you like, making it invalid UTF-8 if
you like
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15:10 < jumzi> No! Don't encourage that behavior *cry*
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15:14 < cde> iant: right.  I was actually thinking about range
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15:17 < wrtp> jumzi: there are useful things you can do with that, e.g.
http://blog.nella.org/?p=810
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15:18 < wrtp> iant: in go terms, there's no such thing as an immutable byte
array :-)
15:18 < wrtp> is there?
15:19 <+iant> well, if there *were* an immutable byte array, it would be the
same as a string constant with different syntax
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15:26 < wrtp> iant: yeah
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15:28 < wrtp> iant: BTW i enjoyed your latest blog post.  good to see some
nice sf recommendations.  must get the latest banks.
15:28 <+iant> thx
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15:31 < wrtp> iant: OT, but here's a recommendation for you.  just read it &
thought it was great: http://www.amazon.com/Air-Have-Not-Geoff-Ryman/dp/0312261217
15:31 <+iant> thanks, I haven't heard of it, I'll check it out
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15:40 < kimelto> 6prof: ctlproc unimplemented in FreeBSD :'(
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17:00 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k5Trp by [Michael Hoisie] in go/src/pkg/net/
-- net: fix close of Listener
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18:47 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k6h1S by [Russ Cox] in go/ -- A+C: Patrick
Gavlin (individual CLA)
18:48 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k6h2d by [Russ Cox] in go/src/pkg/strconv/ --
strconv: update ftoa comment for 'E' and 'G'
18:48 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k6h33 by [Robert Griesemer] in 5 subdirs of
go/src/ -- go/ast: provide complete node text range info
18:48 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k6h4P by [Patrick Gavlin] in 2 subdirs of go/
-- gc: rewrite complex /= to l = l / r.
18:48 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k6h5O by [Russ Cox] in 2 subdirs of go/ --
merge tree -- [1 added, 1 modified] -- bug315.go (A), walk.c (U)
18:48 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k6h62 by [Patrick Gavlin] in
go/src/pkg/encoding/binary/ -- encoding/binary: reject types with
implementation-dependent sizes
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19:38 < Venom_X> hi, is there any way to debug go code in xcode's debugger
gui?
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20:30 < SoniaKeys> i do think a built in zero() would be nice, that would
reset an object to the zero object for its type, as if it were just created.
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20:39 < exch> SoniaKeys: var foo T; <- that doesn't work for you?
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20:40 < SoniaKeys> the first time, yes, but if you want to reuse foo, it
would be nice to have an obvious way to zero it in place.
20:42 < exch> foo = nil;
20:42 < exch> nil always uses the zer value for that given type
20:42 < exch> *zero
20:43 < aiju> can't you even do &nil for pointers?
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20:43 < exch> if foo is a slice for instance, foo = nil will set foo to a
slice of type T with 0 length and 0 capacity
20:43 < exch> you can use it in append, or wherever as-is, because it is
still a valid slice
20:44 < SoniaKeys> but if it is a struct, or an array?
20:44 < aiju> works similarly
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20:50 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k6GLJ by [Rob Pike] in go/src/pkg/regexp/ --
regexp: implement early out for failed anchored search.
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21:21 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k6NsH by [Icarus Sparry] in go/lib/godoc/ --
The Dec 06 change
21:22 < plexdev> http://is.gd/k6NsS by [Robert Griesemer] in 4 subdirs of
go/src/pkg/ -- fix occurrences of occur[^sr .,?!;\n]
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23:05 < jhawk28> hello
23:06 < jhawk28> I'm kinda new to pointers, how do I refer to the value of
the pointer?
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23:06 < Eko> jhawk28: often in Go, you don't need to dereference pointers
23:07 < Eko> if you do, say, val := new(Class); you can refer to the members
of the class like val.member = blah.
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23:07 < Eko> you can also call methods of val the same way, even though it's
a *Class, like val.Method()
23:07 < Eko> if, however, you DO need to get the Class from a *Class, you
can say *val.
23:08 < jhawk28> http://pastebin.com/NV3vS4sh
23:08 < jhawk28> thats what I am trying to do
23:09 < Eko> see http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html#Calls and
http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html#Selectors
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23:10 < Eko> jhawk28: I think you want num := 0; ...  d.Decode(&num)
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23:11 < jhawk28> nice, that was it
23:12 < jhawk28> does the & dereference the num?
23:13 < Eko> http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html#Address_operators
23:13 < Eko> the & takes the address of the variable, makinga Type into a
*Type
23:13 < Eko> the * gets the value at an address, making a *Type into a Type.
23:13 < jhawk28> makes sense
23:14 < Eko> the reason Decode needed a pointer to the int was because it
has to be able to change an int, and values are passed by value not by reference
in Go
23:14 < Venom_X> has anyone tried to get xcode to attach to a go program's
process for debugging?
23:14 < jhawk28> haven't had too much experience with pointers as a mostly
JVM dev
23:14 < Eko> so you need a pointer or a container type for the function to
be able to modify it in such a way that the change sticks outside of the function.
23:15 < Eko> Venom_X:
http://blog.golang.org/2010/11/debugging-go-code-status-report.html
23:15 < Venom_X> yeah, read that.  I can debug in gdb..  but I really like
the gui debugger
23:15 < Eko> jhawk28: then you will be most familiar with classes whose
methods are all targeted on a pointer; e.g.  func (c *Class) f(...) ...  {...}
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23:16 < Eko> Venom_X: it's been too long since I used xcode; does it not
have a gdb/mi target or anything?
23:16 < Venom_X> don't believe so.  At least I haven't found that
23:17 < Eko> Venom_X: how hard was it to get gdb working in OS X? I haven't
bothered doing it yet
23:17 < Venom_X> I know that in a project you can set all sorts of compiling
options..  But, there isn't a go project AFAIK
23:17 < Eko> Venom_X: if there was, it'd be in $GOROOT/misc or
$GOROOT/src/misc whichever
23:18 < jhawk28> is there a way to use the short initialization form (i :=
0) to initialize i as an unsigned int?
23:18 < Venom_X> Eko: it's quite simple.  Just get the 7.x gdb source
compile and run chgrp procmod gdb; chmod g+s gdb;
23:19 < Venom_X> I'm installing ddd right now..  Hoping that'll work for
me..  Haven't used it since I got into osx
23:20 < Eko> jhawk28: i:= uint(0)
23:20 < Eko> Venom_X: gotta head to dinner, maybe I'll try when I get back.
I've hacked with xcode quite a bit, maybe I can get it working.
23:21 < Venom_X> Eko: thanks for the enthusiasm.  Let me know what comes of
it.  Bon appetite
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23:26 < jhawk28> Eko: thanks for the help
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--- Log closed Wed Jan 05 00:00:01 2011