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01:45 < knowmercy> anyone have experience running go http stuff on lower
power setups like soekris?
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03:05 < jessta> knowmercy: I don't imagine there would be much difference
03:05 < knowmercy> :)
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04:54 < f2f> uriel, check out "squinting at power series" again.  pike has a
good tail-call solution there with the 'become' operator.  i admit i haven't seen
a need for it.  i don't know if they even considered it for go.  "go is not
scheme" is another quote from rsc to add to the above ones :)
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04:56 < f2f> hah, s/pike/mcilroy/ sorry.  the language is still pike's
newsqueak.
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05:02 < f2f> smw, http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nocloakonjoin
05:03 < smw> f2f, why did you send me that?
05:04 < f2f> because every time you join you first have your normal IP, then
quit and then rejoin again using the cloak.  it's mildly annoying on the channel,
but you also probably don't want to have your real ip exposed.
05:04 < f2f> here's what everybody sees:
05:04 < f2f> 22:59 *** smw
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05:05 < smw> f2f, everyone sees me quit and then rejoin?
05:06 < smw> f2f, I will fix that :-)
05:06 < smw> f2f, if it was just people seeing my real ip, I would have just
ignored it
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05:06 < smw> f2f, what should I set the delay to?
05:06 < f2f> no, it's join/quit/join.  so you join twice :)
05:07 < f2f> i don't know.  second or two?  i'm not using the cloak so i
don't know what current response times are.
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06:06 < dmg> I've submitted my lzo bindings to the Go Dashboard.  Should I
do anything else?
06:07 < dmg> Is there a link on go packaging I should read and make sure my
code is conformant to?
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06:15 < jessta> dmg: doesn't it goinstall?
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06:24 < chilts> if I want to be sure that each developer has the right
versions of libraries, I'm probably going to put them inside my code tree (rather
than using goinstall) ...  so how would I import something like
'github.com/bradfitz/memcache'?
06:25 < chilts> e.g.  I have program.go and
github.com/bradfitz/memcache/memcache.go
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06:25 < chilts> import ( memcache "github.com/bradfitz/memcache/memcache" )
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06:27 < chomp> well that's exactly how you'd import it (though the first
"memcache" is superfluous), but do you mean you want to import a specific state of
that repository?
06:29 < chilts> yeah, let's say he changes it, well I want to be sure each
developer has the same version installed
06:29 < chilts> and we upgrade it together ...  so by doing that we're all
using the same code
06:31 < jessta> chilts: the import declaration refers to a directory with
the package tree.
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06:32 < jessta> if you want a single version then just fetch that version,
put it in the same relative directory and point the complier/linker at that
directory
06:32 < chilts> so I need to do something extra than just import
path/to/module, even though it's in the same directory?
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06:33 < chomp> generally if you depend on a specific version, you want to
package it with your code
06:33 < chilts> yep, that's what I'm doing
06:33 < chilts> I just can't get it to see it when doing '6g program.go'
06:33 < chilts> can't find import: github.com/bradfitz/gomemcache/memcache
06:33 < chomp> you should look into a build tool like gb
06:33 < chilts> ok ...  but still, I should just be able to get it to
compile?  :)
06:33 < chomp> that sort of package signature will not work if you're
bundling the pacakge with your project
06:33 < jessta> chilts: 6g -I path/to/packages
06:34 < chomp> bi
06:34 < chomp> mp*
06:34 < chilts> ah, I'll try that ...  thanks
06:34 < chomp> wow typing fail.  i meant "no" :)
06:44 < chilts> ok, I had to compile that first inside it's own directory
...  and renamed _go_.6 to memcache.go
06:44 < chilts> then had to tell go that it is a relative path, with
"./path/to/memcache"
06:44 < chilts> ie.  ./ made it work
06:44 < chilts> thanks all
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06:57 < dmg> chilts: Is there anything weird I have to do to support
goinstall?
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07:02 < dmg> chilts: goinstall seemed to work.
07:02 < dmg> easy enough.
07:03 < chilts> sorry, I don't know enough yet to comment I'm afraid :)
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07:30 < jessta> dmg: goinstall only works if you have only files for a
single package in one directory
07:30 < jessta> it's nice to have to directory be the same name as the
package name
07:31 < jessta> it's nice to provide documentation and it's nice to gofmt
code
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09:33 < dmg> jessta: all my source is in a single directory, so I'm fine
there.  I was running gofmt during development, so that's good too.  I'll just
look into godoc I guess.
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10:17 < wrtp> smw: you can scan into a big
10:20 < Argue> there's no way to do type Foo interface { Compare(same type
as this Foo) int; } is there
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10:36 < jessta> Argue: nope
10:37 < jessta> you can only do, type Foo interface{ Compare(Foo) int;}
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10:48 < uriel> f2f: I think Alef had something like become (but I never
wrote alef), but given it was left out of Limbo and Go, there probably must have
turned out not to be that useful?
10:49 < Argue> yeah thought so.  ah well :[
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11:09 < Kahvi> What kind of web apps benefit from using Go instead of
PHP/Django/ASP.NET/Something?  Or is it just matter of preference?
11:12 < uriel> any apps that you want to write in a language that is not a
horrible mess?
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11:13 < moraes> to be honest, go is still infant in terms of web libraries.
11:13 < moraes> also, django is not a language.
11:14 < moraes> :P
11:15 < uriel> nor is ASP.NET, or PHP (;P)
11:15 < vegai> django is pretty nice, though
11:16 < vegai> just replaced with a colleague a java clusterfuck in two
weeks with django
11:16 < moraes> but go will will kick ass in terms of web libraries.
11:24 < uriel> django is fucking awful
11:25 < uriel> not as bad as RoR, but that is not saying much
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12:02 < nsf> uhm, I started to work on experimental project 'diego' (a Go
I/O lib port to D)
12:02 < nsf> and I've noticed one thing in io.go
12:02 < nsf> / ErrShortWrite means that a write accepted fewer bytes than
requested
12:02 < nsf> / but failed to return an explicit error.
12:02 < aiju> what's up?
12:02 < nsf> but Writer interface explicitly says: Write must return a
non-nil error if it returns n < len(p).
12:02 < nsf> so..  I don't get it
12:03 < aiju> nsf: UNIX syscalls don't provide an error message in that case
12:03 < aiju> no code like EIO or EINVAL
12:03 < nsf> aiju: who cares
12:03 < aiju> so the generic ErrShortWrite is used
12:03 < nsf> if someone can't implement Writer interface
12:03 < nsf> it's their problem
12:03 < nsf> it _must_ return non-nil
12:03 < aiju> nsf: you're reading the message wrong
12:03 < aiju> s/message/comment
12:04 < aiju> it returns n, ErrShortWrite
12:04 < nsf> correct me then
12:04 < aiju> not n, nil
12:04 < nsf> aiju: ok, I should explain why I'm conserned
12:04 < aiju> ErrShortWrite is not considered "explicit" since it doesn't
give any information about what went wrong
12:04 < nsf> there is a Copy function
12:04 < nsf> which basically checks
12:04 < nsf> if Writer returned less than bytes in a buffer argument, return
ErrShortWrite
12:05 < nsf> but according to Writer spec it cannot happen
12:05 < aiju> what can't happen?
12:05 < nsf> well it can
12:05 < nsf> but few lines before that
12:05 < nsf> error is being checked
12:06 < nsf> so, practically there is dead code
12:06 < aiju> yes
12:06 < nsf> in io.Copy
12:06 < aiju> it's called "writing programs which don't blow up on every
other occasion" ;P
12:06 < nsf> line 341
12:06 < nsf> ok
12:06 < aiju> might also be a relict of earlier times
12:06 < nsf> I'll just put assert there
12:06 < nsf> I forgot Go doesn't have asserts
12:06 < aiju> thank god for that
12:08 < jlaffaye> I like asserts
12:09 < nsf> jlaffaye: you just don't know aiju, he dislikes more things
than you can imagine
12:09 < nsf> :D
12:10 < jlaffaye> ;)
12:10 < aiju> programming is serious business
12:10 < aiju> no place for hippie lovefests
12:10 < uriel> nsf: I'd post to the dev list about this
12:10 < uriel> aiju: hahaha
12:11 < jlaffaye> I guess I use assert in C in the same case you would use
if blah { panic } in go
12:11 < nsf> uriel: well, aiju convinced me that maybe it's just a
bullet-proof piece of code
12:11 < nsf> in case if someone implements Writer wrong
12:11 < uriel> nsf: never hurts checking with the horse's mouth
12:12 < nsf> these are just 4 lines of code that don't do anything horrible
12:12 < nsf> I'm too lazy to post that on the ML :)
12:13 < nsf> does anyone want to know how it looks in D?
12:13 < nsf> http://pastie.org/2365679
12:13 < nsf> :D
12:13 < aiju> abstract string to_string() const;
12:13 < nsf> :D
12:14 < aiju> returning structs is ugly in these cases
12:14 < nsf> I know
12:14 < nsf> I've tried different options
12:14 < nsf> like passing a pointer to Error as a last argument
12:14 < nsf> defaulting to null
12:14 < nsf> and throwing exception
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12:14 < nsf> but ugh..  structs are actually not that bad
12:15 < aiju> pointer seems like the best idea
12:15 < nsf> aiju: it looks better as an interface, but when you're actually
using it
12:15 < nsf> not so much
12:16 < nsf> create a var, pass it to func, check its value
12:16 < aiju> why?
12:16 < nsf> and with struct you just have r.error
12:16 < nsf> and r.n
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12:19 < nsf> ah, there is a feature in D, Go slices may benefit from
12:19 < nsf> $ symbol as a shortcut to len(slice)
12:20 < nsf> x := slice[$-5:$]
12:20 < nsf> five elements from the end
12:20 < nsf> it's better than [:]
12:20 < aiju> that seems like an ugly feature
12:20 < nsf> because it's explicit
12:20 < nsf> and you can do math
12:21 < aiju> so there is some magic in the parser to recognize such
expressions?
12:21 < aiju> does $ refer to the innermost []?
12:21 < nsf> well, it's D
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12:21 < aiju> hahahaha
12:21 < aiju> it's guaranteed to be full of cruft
12:21 < nsf> there is opDollar operator overloading method
12:21 < nsf> also
12:21 < aiju> ugh
12:21 < nsf> I guess it refers to innermost, yes
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16:32 < qeed> if i wanted to write a wrapper for say unsafe.Offsetof how do
i pass arbitrarytype
16:32 < qeed> and how would the function be declared
16:32 < aiju> qeed: i doubt this is possible
16:32 < aiju> unsafe is a bunch of hacks
16:32 < aiju> and magic
16:34 < qeed> ok thanks
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17:21 < jessta> qeed: arbitaryType isn't a real type
17:22 < jessta> it's just a placeholder for "any type"
17:24 < qeed> so can a regular function declaration accept it as a
parameter?
17:27 < jessta> nope
17:27 < jessta> unsafe can do things that aren't allowed in any other
package
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17:30 < jessta> qeed: if you want to wrap unsafe.Offsetof then the wrapper
would have to take interface{} and type assert
17:31 < qeed> its not so important i dont mind typing more i guess
17:36 < s|k> it's not clear to me from the specification if copy() creates a
new underlying array or resuses the same array of the original slice
17:36 < s|k> I assume it's the same array?
17:37 < s|k> also what happens if you append to a slice that is the subset
of an array with a larger capacity?  does it change the underlying array or does
it change the value in the array (and as such for all other slices with the same
array)?
17:38 < aiju> s|k: it uses the underlying array
17:38 < s|k> hrm
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17:39 < s|k> so copy is just the same as using [0:] ?
17:39 < aiju> no
17:39 < s|k> what's the difference?
17:39 < aiju> [:] doesn't copy the underlying data
17:40 < s|k> I'm not sure I understand the difference
17:40 < jessta> s|k: copy() is for copying between slices, not copying a
slice
17:40 < s|k> ohhh
17:41 < s|k> so what about appending to a slice that is a subset of a larger
array?
17:41 < s|k> does that change the value of the index of len(slice)+1 in the
array or create a new underlying array?
17:41 < aiju> it changes the value of len
17:42 < s|k> I'm going to test this
17:42 < s|k> thanks
17:43 < jessta> s|k:
http://golang.org/doc/go_spec.html#Appending_and_copying_slices
17:43 < jessta> the spec is pretty clear
17:44 < s|k> " Thus, the returned slice may refer to a different underlying
array."
17:44 < s|k> it says 'may'
17:44 < aiju> s|k: read the entire sentence
17:44 < aiju> s/sentence/paragraph
17:44 < s|k> heh
17:44 < s|k> yes you are right
17:44 < s|k> ok got it
17:45 < s|k> I have been reading the specification for a long time
17:45 < s|k> I should take a break
17:45 < aiju> possibly too long
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18:29 < moraes> you can't get the name of a function using reflect, right?
18:29 < moraes> or some kind of parseable identifier.
18:29 < aiju> you can
18:29 < aiju> but it's not reflect
18:29 < aiju> you need to read the symbol table
18:30 < aiju> debug/gosym looks about right
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18:30 < moraes> hm.  is it something horrible to do?
18:30 < aiju> hm odd
18:30 < aiju> the runtime uses the symbol table to get function names
18:31 < aiju> it should be exposed in a more direct way somewhere else …
18:31 < aiju> http://golang.org/pkg/runtime/#Func.FuncForPC
18:31 < aiju> there you go
18:31 < moraes> thank you, sir.
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--- Log closed Sun Aug 14 00:00:20 2011